Lotus Type 135 EV sportscar

[TomE]

Maybe the type 135 is too, just in better camouflage.

On camouflage you may be joking, but remember there were less than 10 Emira spy shots before the reveal and most looked like Evoras with flared wheel arches.

It would be very easy to run a development Type 135 in an Emira body. Only the (lack of) sound would give it away.

 

[Foxy87]

I like the look of it in that pic. 3300 lbs at that power level in EV should deliver mid low 3.X 0-60 mph times and fantastic on the road performance and handling with the ultra low center of gravity. I’d guess at 250ish range when not flogging it. I agree downsides will be no manual trans and no vrooooooom sounds. But I bet this car will be fun fun fun to toss around and kill some corners. Please please please keep it under $100k USD!!

PS I have some real insight into driving/racing mid engine EV sports cars. I’m the lead driver for team EVSR.net here in the USA. we’ve built 5 cars (two generations of modifications and improvements) and have done hundreds of sprint races with the SCCA and NASA, plus hill climbs and time attacks and twice competed in (and finished strongly) in the NASA 25 hrs of Thunderhill endurance race (that car has our quick change battery packs in it ~ 1:15s or a little less to change batteries and driver during pitstops). We do use LFP battery chemistry which is very stable and not prone to fire or explosion or runaway (but is not as energy dense as Li-ion). The center of gravity of this mid motored 180 hp 1850 lb (no driver) car is crazy low (below the axle height) and in high speed corners it is crazy how much speed you can carry (even on the 205 width moderately hard compound Toyo RA-1 tires that we usually run). It took me quite a few sessions in the beginning to trust the car and just keep adding speed in the corner and not fall off the track! Here’s a couple pic if you are curious

Nice, but seeing this car already at 1900lbs, there is NO way Lotus will achieve a sub 3300lbs EV Sportscar.

 

[Concept24]

Thanks! At least here in the United States we are the only team that is racing door-to-door in electrified vehicles. Yes, these are custom designed from the ground up by a small shop called Entropy Racing. The cars really are amazing to drive and really fun and exciting. And believe me, Im a tough critic because one of my primary personal race cars is a lotus super seven series III that I vintage race! Not exactly anything like any kind of an EV race car ha ha! When we race these cars, we race them against all gas powered cars since there are no other EVs to race against. And we do more than hold our own most times! 😊

On a down note right now, the sanctioning bodies starting this year are trying to apply an all EV ban on the race tracks in United States. The thinking is that the EV cars that are being produced today by manufacturers and that would try to go on a race track even in a drivers education situation almost all have the unsafe battery chemistry that can cause big fires that are hard to put out. So they are putting out a blanket ruling that basically just says no EVs no matter what. We have tried to appeal explaining that we run the LFP battery chemistry that is very safe, but they do not wish to change the blanket ruling for fear that there will be issues with people trying to sneak in with the unsafe battery chemistry. At this point , I think Entropy Racing is ready to throw in the towel which is very unfortunate. We have been racing here for nearly 10 years developing the cars and never had any issues.

Do you think solid state batteries will become a reality? They seem to be a "holy grail" of sorts when it comes to density and safety.

 

[GetawayDriving]

Nice, but seeing this car already at 1900lbs, there is NO way Lotus will achieve a sub 3300lbs EV Sportscar.

Some quick googling shows Nissan Leaf battery (62 kWh) weighs ~770 lbs and the Toyota V6 is estimated to weigh ~780 lbs.

A Tesla drive unit is ~290 lbs.
Evora transmission is ~130 lbs

Lotus has bought themselves an extra 125 lbs in their target weight over Emira.

Seems entirely possible to me.

 

[simonb]

you just wont get light weight and long range

 

[KusaKusa]

Hoping it looks more “baby Evija” than that illustration. But yeah weight will be key. And no way it makes 2025 launch!

Type 135 will likely have a 2025 reveal and was originally targeted for 2026 launch. Recent interviews seem to indicate it'll slip into 2027 launch, which could even mean 2028 for the US.

Russell Carr’s team, who did the Evija and Emira, so I’m hopeful it will continue the design language. Design work is well underway.

Yep, and maybe it'll look even better than the Emira. Late 2021 when there was still hype around the Emira reveal, Matt Windle signed off on the design, and in an interview he said it looked GOOD with strong emphasis.

This is the first article I've seen mention 3,300 lbs. Would be great if true. 66 kwh not a ton, but may not have to be if they hit that weight.

Lotus has been targeting the same weight as the heaviest Emira for some time. Not sure if C&D approximated 3300lb or if they got it from insiders like some other info in the article. Here's what Windle had to say a couple years ago:

"I've actually seen some of the initial work they're doing on the next sports car [Type 135] and it's blown me away already. It will be everything we want it to be: beautiful, lightweight. It will be the Lotus you expect and it will have an amazing performance as well. We are driven by those [principles], lightweighting, dynamics, aerodynamics, they're our core that have been in our business from Chapman...

"The challenge that I've set them for Type 135 is that it needs to weigh the same as Emira as an electric-propulsion car. So they've had to think differently, and the weight saving is significant between what they've done on Project LEVA and where we currently are."

Some quick googling shows Nissan Leaf battery (62 kWh) weighs ~770 lbs and the Toyota V6 is estimated to weigh ~780 lbs.

A Tesla drive unit is ~290 lbs.
Evora transmission is ~130 lbs

Lotus has bought themselves an extra 125 lbs in their target weight over Emira.

Seems entirely possible to me.

That's similar to what Richard Rackham has said when the LEVA platform was first revealed. According to Rackham, the mass and packaging of the battery, cabling and motor(s) approximates the weight and physical dimensions of a comparably powerful internal combustion powertrain

I really hope that Lotus absolutely nail the Type 135! The only other electric sports car (not supercar, or sporty sedan) that I can name off the top of my head is the first generation Tesla Roadster, and that one was even based on the Lotus Elise. And so if Lotus play their cards right, they could have a HUGE head start over other electric sports car manufacturers!

As someone mentioned, there's the Porsche Cayman EV in 2024/2025. Also, there's the MG Cyberster in around the same time, but that's a good amount over 4000lb. Maserati has the Granturismo Folgore (EV), but that's more of a GT 2+2 coupe than a sports car. It's about the length of a midsize sedan (BMW 5 Series) and super heavy since it's an ICE platform.

The unofficial target specs for the Type 135 are exciting. They include staying close to the weight, range and price of the Emira. That gives some serious challenges on battery tech and lightweight engineering. But will mean a very quick and well-handling car.

Here were the high level targets for the vehicle when Lotus was still deciding what technologies to use for the platform. Even if the battery is smaller, with a modern chemistry, the weight targets, and the lower drag due to being a lower car without batteries underneath everything, it could get a decent range.

Here's a slide from the Lotus Technology investor presentation, showing the target MSRP and launch timing. It seems like it'll be a bit more expensive than the Emira, so maybe topping out at close to $120k with all options.

I have a compilation of all Type 135 news and Lotus white papers for the LEVA platform at another Lotus forum. Hopefully mods are okay with me sharing that link, since I don't want to have to bring it all back over here lol. If not, I can take it down.

 

[Foxy87]

Some quick googling shows Nissan Leaf battery (62 kWh) weighs ~770 lbs and the Toyota V6 is estimated to weigh ~780 lbs.

A Tesla drive unit is ~290 lbs.
Evora transmission is ~130 lbs

Lotus has bought themselves an extra 125 lbs in their target weight over Emira.

Seems entirely possible to me.

Like the same how they first stated the Eletre will be 2000kg?

 

[EspritGuy]

Confirmed as Hethel for Type 135. Wuhan is for the “Lifestyle” vehicles. Hethel is also likely to build the Alpine version too - the Type 135 platform is a joint venture.

It may get crowded.
I gather Emira won't be the priority at that point (shiny penny syndrome).

 

[dgrace]

Type 135 will likely have a 2025 reveal and was originally targeted for 2026 launch. Recent interviews seem to indicate it'll slip into 2027 launch, which could even mean 2028 for the US....

This whole post was filled with great info - thanks for sharing! I remember the Matt Windle podcast interview and I've been interested in the car ever since.

Edit: though, hilariously, the Emira comfort feature Windle calls out is that the windshield wipers work flawlessly. Umm... not so much I guess!

 

[TomE]

Type 135 will likely have a 2025 reveal and was originally targeted for 2026 launch. Recent interviews seem to indicate it'll slip into 2027 launch, which could even mean 2028 for the US.


Yep, and maybe it'll look even better than the Emira. Late 2021 when there was still hype around the Emira reveal, Matt Windle signed off on the design, and in an interview he said it looked GOOD with strong emphasis.


Lotus has been targeting the same weight as the heaviest Emira for some time. Not sure if C&D approximated 3300lb or if they got it from insiders like some other info in the article. Here's what Windle had to say a couple years ago:

"I've actually seen some of the initial work they're doing on the next sports car [Type 135] and it's blown me away already. It will be everything we want it to be: beautiful, lightweight. It will be the Lotus you expect and it will have an amazing performance as well. We are driven by those [principles], lightweighting, dynamics, aerodynamics, they're our core that have been in our business from Chapman...

"The challenge that I've set them for Type 135 is that it needs to weigh the same as Emira as an electric-propulsion car. So they've had to think differently, and the weight saving is significant between what they've done on Project LEVA and where we currently are."


That's similar to what Richard Rackham has said when the LEVA platform was first revealed. According to Rackham, the mass and packaging of the battery, cabling and motor(s) approximates the weight and physical dimensions of a comparably powerful internal combustion powertrain


As someone mentioned, there's the Porsche Cayman EV in 2024/2025. Also, there's the MG Cyberster in around the same time, but that's a good amount over 4000lb. Maserati has the Granturismo Folgore (EV), but that's more of a GT 2+2 coupe than a sports car. It's about the length of a midsize sedan (BMW 5 Series) and super heavy since it's an ICE platform.


Here were the high level targets for the vehicle when Lotus was still deciding what technologies to use for the platform. Even if the battery is smaller, with a modern chemistry, the weight targets, and the lower drag due to being a lower car without batteries underneath everything, it could get a decent range.

Here's a slide from the Lotus Technology investor presentation, showing the target MSRP and launch timing. It seems like it'll be a bit more expensive than the Emira, so maybe topping out at close to $120k with all options.

I have a compilation of all Type 135 news and Lotus white papers for the LEVA platform at another Lotus forum. Hopefully mods are okay with me sharing that link, since I don't want to have to bring it all back over here lol. If not, I can take it down.

I follow your very informative Type 135 posts over on the other place. Thanks for curating a summary on here for people. Absolutely no problem with posting links to other sources of info.

 

[Concept24]

you just wont get light weight and long range

or perhaps high sustained speed, either. Teslas were famous for failure to complete multiple high-speed laps of VIR without stopping to recharge. And their battery packs are large.

 

[Porter]

I think they (Geely) really don't understand what people use a sports car for. This sort of battery and range spec would only make sense for someone using it to "be seen" on the way to dinner.

If you are really driving it in earnest, the range is going to drop down from 250mi+ to 100-150mi at best. People interested in going for epic twisty-road drives to remote locations need not apply.

 

[Concept24]

Perhaps this is why most sportscars (with Porsche as an exception) that are not purely ICE, are hybrids. We now have McLaren and Corvette hybrids. How are they selling?

 

[KusaKusa]

I think they (Geely) really don't understand what people use a sports car for. This sort of battery and range spec would only make sense for someone using it to "be seen" on the way to dinner.

If you are really driving it in earnest, the range is going to drop down from 250mi+ to 100-150mi at best. People interested in going for epic twisty-road drives to remote locations need not apply.

Lotus' main focus in those scenarios may be focused on the fast charging. You could drive to the location, do your twisty drive, charge and eat, then drive back.

The Eletre does 10-80% battery in 20 minutes with a 350kW charger, and it can charge up to 420kW if chargers allow it. The Hyundai-Kia EVs, renowned for their charge speed, can only do up to 350kW. But charge rates may not be applicable to Type 135 because it has a much smaller battery; as a general rule, the smaller the battery, the worse higher charge/discharge rates are for the longevity of the battery. Some chemistries can be more specialized for charge/discharge than pure capacity/range.

 

[Toomanyloti]

ahem...there are no f*cking chargers anywhere

My mum had a 'funny turn' about 20 miles too far away for the Taycan to make it so I went in my rather marvellous toyota pro ace diesel.
If all electric is ever going to be a 'thing' then they should chill the f out making cars and get their heads around distributing the power.

nobs!

 

[Eddmac]

Looks like an electric Emira to me.

 

[Pugwash]

Stopped at Knutsford services going North yesterday. Only two chargers there. The bays were roped off with red/white hazard tape as out of order. !!!!

 

[Lotustoronto]

Looks like Alpine may be leaving the Lotus partnership. They have a target of 2026 to be fully electric.

Renault Leans Toward Making Alpine On Its Own, Not With Lotus

 

[simonb]

Where they are going with the A290 beta looks like no assistance is needed

 

[GetawayDriving]

Where they are going with the A290 beta looks like no assistance is needed

That A290 is a truly lustworthy daily.