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Auto only: Turbo vs V6?
- Thread starter CarGuy07
- Start date
When I test drove both, I thought the auto in the turbo was a lot more responsive than the v6 auto. I chose the turbo for future tune ability and the m139 engine is pretty stout. Never heard of major frequent issues in the Mercedes A43 or CLA forums. With that said, you can never go wrong with Toyota reliability and I believe I saw JUBU offers an Audi DSG upgrade for the V6
- Thread starter
- #3
^ how’s the sound of the turbo vs V6?
I think you’re referring to this: https://www.jubu-performance.com/en/shop/part-jubu_dct__doppelkupplungsgetriebe_v6-2219
It’s $22K USD for the conversion. Probably makes more sense to get the turbo version unless someone really prefers the V6+DCT.
I think you’re referring to this: https://www.jubu-performance.com/en/shop/part-jubu_dct__doppelkupplungsgetriebe_v6-2219
It’s $22K USD for the conversion. Probably makes more sense to get the turbo version unless someone really prefers the V6+DCT.
Dual clutch transmissions just feel so much better than torque converter automatics. There's never a time when they're fluid coupled, like a traditional auto, so it makes the car feel more responsive.
Modern turbo engines are amazing too, with very broad torque curves, more broad than that V6. I bought my V6 because I wanted the manual transmission, but if I had to buy the auto, I'd definitely go AMG, even though Toyota's engines are simpler and more reliable.
Modern turbo engines are amazing too, with very broad torque curves, more broad than that V6. I bought my V6 because I wanted the manual transmission, but if I had to buy the auto, I'd definitely go AMG, even though Toyota's engines are simpler and more reliable.
Inside the car, both sound amazing but I prefer the turbo sound. From the outside, the i4 doesn’t sound as impressive, but the v6 doesn’t sound all that great either. Either way, I think aftermarket exhausts will be needed. I think the v6 with 3rd car delete could be enough to achieve a great sound while the i4 would need a full exhaust.
Perhaps this article will help with your decision...
From a sound perspective, installed the valve controller on my i4 and it really brings the car to life. Waiting for GRP to offer a 2nd cat delete pipe, and I'll be done with mods.
From a sound perspective, installed the valve controller on my i4 and it really brings the car to life. Waiting for GRP to offer a 2nd cat delete pipe, and I'll be done with mods.
Jinba ittai
Emira Fan
If I were you I’d do the turbo for the DCT.
- Thread starter
- #8
So I went to drive the turbo yesterday evening. My thoughts below:
- sport suspension was too jittery for my liking
- there was a rattle in the driver side window sill that the salesperson said was seatbelt (definitely was not the seatbelt as I held it and the door/window was still rattling)
- engine was potent. Sounded good inside but pretty quiet outside.
- DCT was quicker than the V6 slush box but it’s definitely no PDK (downshifts were quick in sport mode while upshifts were a bit slower). I felt sometimes when I downshifted coming to a stop, it didn’t really react.
- everything else was pretty good: sound system, looks, interior, etc.
I’m still conflicted as I really want to like the Emira. It’s a bit below budget too. I just can’t help feeling like I need a bit more from the car.
- sport suspension was too jittery for my liking
- there was a rattle in the driver side window sill that the salesperson said was seatbelt (definitely was not the seatbelt as I held it and the door/window was still rattling)
- engine was potent. Sounded good inside but pretty quiet outside.
- DCT was quicker than the V6 slush box but it’s definitely no PDK (downshifts were quick in sport mode while upshifts were a bit slower). I felt sometimes when I downshifted coming to a stop, it didn’t really react.
- everything else was pretty good: sound system, looks, interior, etc.
I’m still conflicted as I really want to like the Emira. It’s a bit below budget too. I just can’t help feeling like I need a bit more from the car.
If I was set on auto I would go DCT and turbo. I imagine it will feel faster due to how the engine builds torque and the directness of the DCT.
If you prioritize sound I would go with the v6 auto and 3rd car delete. It sounds genuinely exotic and you will be happy knowing you have a larger displacement v6 behind you. If you haven’t heard it I would try to find a forum member near you with this mod. It sounds very different from stock.
If you prioritize sound I would go with the v6 auto and 3rd car delete. It sounds genuinely exotic and you will be happy knowing you have a larger displacement v6 behind you. If you haven’t heard it I would try to find a forum member near you with this mod. It sounds very different from stock.
Really? I would have expected the I4 to have a significant advantage because of the much fatter HP curve despite having similar "peak" numbers.
Correct (I4 torque comes on strong and early), the I4-V6 gap grows ever larger as speeds increase.
I know Lotus cars are not about straight line bragging rights however just looking at the test results:
Ref. https://www.emiraforum.com/threads/jan-2025-car-driver-emira-amg-one-pager.5617/
Ref. (V6 Manual) https://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/a45779706/2024-lotus-emira-test/
Last edited:
I4 sports w/ cup 2s 5-60 = 4.5 sec
V6 touring w/ Goodyears 5-60 = 4.7 sec
Additionally, the gap in acceleration between sports and touring accounts for 0.1-0.2 seconds.
The I4 (sports) has a torque advantage but has to overcome turbo lag, evidenced by the 1.1 sec gap between its 0-60 and 5-60 times, as opposed to 0.4 sec for the V6 (touring).
V6 touring w/ Goodyears 5-60 = 4.7 sec
Additionally, the gap in acceleration between sports and touring accounts for 0.1-0.2 seconds.
The I4 (sports) has a torque advantage but has to overcome turbo lag, evidenced by the 1.1 sec gap between its 0-60 and 5-60 times, as opposed to 0.4 sec for the V6 (touring).
True. 0-60 and 1/4 mile are the gold standard, yet they are calculated times, not measurements. 0-60 not only omits 1-ft rollout of 0.2 sec, but relies on the highest rpm launch possible. It's often cited because it results in the quickest acceleration times, but it's rarely understood. It's not representive of street performance. 5-60 is the most realistic acceleration figure and is achievable in the real world. It's not cited because it's usually 0.1-1.5 seconds slower than 0-60 depending on the vehicles power delivery.
Without the high rpm launch and rollout omitted, acceleration between i4 and v6 is similar which is difficult to comprehend if only citing 0-60.
In another thread a US AMG owner just shared his infotainment performance data, wonder how close to reality this data is.... What torque and HP figures does the US V6 max out at? would be a good reference point
Adam Brouillard
Well-known member
The 5-60 test is a good way to find out how fast a car will be when pulling from idle speed, like in an impromptu drag race where you aren’t using launch control or a clutch drop. Electric cars and large displacement engines are good at this because they still make good power at very low rpm. Small, high revving engines are bad at this. Turbo engines are also not good at this because even though they can help improve power at relatively low rpm, they are still below the boost threshold near idle speeds. This is separate from turbo lag though. Turbo lag is when you have a power delay once past the boost threshold when you go to throttle. I don’t notice any turbo lag in my I4, but you can definitely feel the boost come on at around 2000 rpm or so if you try to pull hard from idle. For economy, the car likes to stay in low rpm when just driving around, so if you want to have good power on tap you’ll need to keep the car in sport mode. If you give it some throttle in tour mode however, it seems like it will then go into a sort of temporary sport mode holding a lower gear for a bit before settling back down.
If all you have to go on is Car and Driver numbers, you can look at the difference between the 0-60 and 0-100 times to get an idea of how the power in a car will feel when just driving around town or on a racetrack. That gives you a 60-100 time, which will give you a good idea of a car’s general acceleration ability.
If all you have to go on is Car and Driver numbers, you can look at the difference between the 0-60 and 0-100 times to get an idea of how the power in a car will feel when just driving around town or on a racetrack. That gives you a 60-100 time, which will give you a good idea of a car’s general acceleration ability.
All turbos lag, as they need revs to build boost. Turbo lag is any delay in power delivery as boost builds. It does not need to be past boost threshold. Peak torque in the i4 does not arrive until 3000 rpm. The 1.1 sec gap between the 0-60 and 5-60 is directly attributed to turbo lag and having to wait for boost to build from idle speed.
Adam Brouillard
Well-known member
It's important to understand the difference between turbo lag and the effect of boost threshold. As I previously explained, because of the boost threshold, a turbo engine makes relatively poor power at very low rpm because it doesn't have positive boost yet. It's essentially just a naturally aspirated engine for this first 2000 rpm or so. This is why turbo engines have a relatively slow 5-60 vs 0-60 time. If you want a car that pulls hard from idle, don't get one with a turbo engine as this will happen in all of them unless they have some sort of electric assist.
Once above the boost threshold however, some turbo engines also have turbo lag. This will be a delay between applying throttle and power delivery that happens at any rpm and it can make throttle modulation quite hard on track. This doesn't really show up in any kind of Car and Driver type tests and you really just have to test drive the car to see what kind of throttle response it has. It's much less common nowadays for a high end performance car with a turbo engine to have significant lag, but it can be pretty noticeable in older cars.
Once above the boost threshold however, some turbo engines also have turbo lag. This will be a delay between applying throttle and power delivery that happens at any rpm and it can make throttle modulation quite hard on track. This doesn't really show up in any kind of Car and Driver type tests and you really just have to test drive the car to see what kind of throttle response it has. It's much less common nowadays for a high end performance car with a turbo engine to have significant lag, but it can be pretty noticeable in older cars.
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