Emira vs. GT4 (and side topic: disappointing laptimes of the emira)

[Magma]

To be fair, even a pre-owned 718 GT4 is ~$130k USD these days. You can do A LOT of Emira upgrades with that extra $30k USD and be much quicker around a track than the GT4. Tires, suspension, bolt-ons, tune, and some weight savings...

Some rough high end estimates:

• $5,000 coilovers, alignment, corner balance
• $7,000 exhaust, intake, upgraded supercharger
• $2,000 custom tune
• $4,000 carbon buckets
• $12,000 lighter forged wheels and sticky tires (may not be needed if already spec'd the Cup2s)
• $30k total = 3k lbs. 500WHP supercar killer

And you'll never get that back, whereas the GT4 will hold its value.

 

[Emirahep]

And

Track days can be a humbling experience for sure. That's why they say there's no mod greater than seat time (and brakes)!

And deep pockets !

 

[hagen111]

All I am saying is that it bugs me that the Emira is putting down slow laptimes (so far). And it seems like some people try to defend it or may even be offended because they try to defend their purchase. That is fine by me, its kind of normal I guess.

It bugs me as well. The car of the year test in The Netherlands resulted in very slow lap times for Emira. Laptimes DO state on the quality of engineering of a car...its setup, its engine, its chassis, seating position etc. Comparable cars should about be equally fast if they are well engineered. My expectation is/was: Lotus engineers great FAST cars. Stock Emira is just disappointing. Jethro said it, lap times say it, my own experience...

It's a 400hp mid engine lotus supercar...10 years after the Exige V6 got released. It should do fantastic....

 

[Foxy87]

This so much. You could explain it better then I was able to. Thank you!

So there is now a third slow laptime published? Do you have a link to this car of the year test?

 

[hagen111]

Posted it here:

https://www.emiraforum.com/threads/emira-review-index-7th-june-2022.1442/post-71225

 

[Nova]

It bugs me as well. The car of the year test in The Netherlands resulted in very slow lap times for Emira. Laptimes DO state on the quality of engineering of a car...its setup, its engine, its chassis, seating position etc. Comparable cars should about be equally fast if they are well engineered. My expectation is/was: Lotus engineers great FAST cars. Stock Emira is just disappointing. Jethro said it, lap times say it, my own experience...

It's a 400hp mid engine lotus supercar...10 years after the Exige V6 got released. It should do fantastic....

Sorry, it's hard to take a review seriously where they complain that most of the steering feel has been filtered out and this is certainly not the case for the Emira. The instrumented times also look suspect. Maybe they got a bad sample?

 

[hagen111]

Sorry, it's hard to take a review seriously where they complain that most of the steering feel has been filtered out and this is certainly not the case for the Emira. The instrumented times also look suspect. Maybe they got a bad sample?

In my opinion the criticism on Emira is not on 'steering feel' ...I actually found it a strong point. It is the front end turn in and behavior, that lacks sharpness, it feels numb, as I posted after my own test-drive:

https://www.emiraforum.com/threads/the-great-big-all-the-customer-test-drives-thread.2080/post-74778

 

[Nova]

In my opinion the criticism on Emira is not on 'steering feel' ...I actually found it a strong point. It is the front end turn in and behavior, that lacks sharpness, it feels numb, as I posted after my own test-drive:

https://www.emiraforum.com/threads/the-great-big-all-the-customer-test-drives-thread.2080/post-74778

Have you taken delivery yet? I've been hearing that the production cars are much improved over the review and test drive samples.

 

[Shahaf2911]

Sorry, it's hard to take a review seriously where they complain that most of the steering feel has been filtered out and this is certainly not the case for the Emira. The instrumented times also look suspect. Maybe they got a bad sample?

It’s hard to take a review seriously when it ranks a cupra formentor higher than a RS3 lol, I own an RS3 8Y, owned an M2 (OG), 23 R8 quattro, STO and more and I 100% disagree with this list.
I prefer the lotus over the M2 (and also over the RS3 which I prefer the M2 over), and more than the R8, but ranking an SUV which is a raised RS3 without the new diff better than most of those things ? FFS this is a joke paid review sorry. And don’t get me started on the electric SUV, never understood these irrelevant tests which compare completely different vehicles! So I don’t take their word for times or anything.

 

[hagen111]

It’s hard to take a review seriously when it ranks a cupra formentor higher than a RS3 lol, I own an RS3 8Y, owned an M2 (OG), 23 R8 quattro, STO and more and I 100% disagree with this list.
I prefer the lotus over the M2 (and also over the RS3 which I prefer the M2 over), and more than the R8, but ranking an SUV which is a raised RS3 without the new diff better than most of those things ? FFS this is a joke paid review sorry. And don’t get me started on the electric SUV, never understood these irrelevant tests which compare completely different vehicles! So I don’t take their word for times or anything.

That's just the opinion of Peter Fox, a pro/works driver who has a massive amount of experience and extensive racing career as a works driver...het put Cupra over RS3. Also the editors disagree as they put RS3 in 3rd and Cupra in 7th. As you see...'good' is still very personal. Agree on the DBX...but maybe Aston really created a great package and engineered a really 'good' car.

 

[Shahaf2911]

That's just the opinion of Peter Fox, a pro/works driver who has a massive amount of experience and extensive racing career as a works driver...het put Cupra over RS3. Also the editors disagree as they put RS3 in 3rd and Cupra in 7th. As you see...'good' is still very personal. Agree on the DBX...but maybe Aston really created a great package and engineered a really 'good' car.

Well if the editor disagrees and the article writer as well I must be wrong right ? Well no. If you find a single aspect apart from practicality the cupra suv is better than the RS3 8Y I will agree there is some sense to this article and ranking… but there just isn’t, it’s an suv based on the A3 platform with extra weight and less luxury and tech (mainly the new clever diff).

 

[Foxy87]

In my opinion the criticism on Emira is not on 'steering feel' ...I actually found it a strong point. It is the front end turn in and behavior, that lacks sharpness, it feels numb, as I posted after my own test-drive:

https://www.emiraforum.com/threads/the-great-big-all-the-customer-test-drives-thread.2080/post-74778

Same experience here and written in first post. Turn in didnt feel great, very undefined…

 

[lion shf]

To be fair, even a pre-owned 718 GT4 is ~$130k USD these days. You can do A LOT of Emira upgrades with that extra $30k USD and be much quicker around a track than the GT4. Tires, suspension, bolt-ons, tune, and some weight savings...

Some rough high end estimates:

• $5,000 coilovers, alignment, corner balance
• $7,000 exhaust, intake, upgraded supercharger
• $2,000 custom tune
• $4,000 carbon buckets
• $12,000 lighter forged wheels and sticky tires (may not be needed if already spec'd the Cup2s)
• $30k total = 3k lbs. 500WHP supercar killer

On stock trans. Don’t be silly

 

[Superman]

I, personally, do not see the Emira as a 'fantastic' track car out of the box (and therefore not overly surprised about the 'mediocre' lap times posted by some of the media so far)... It could be, but it would take a little bit of work - Some weight reduction first, sticky tyres, tyre pressures set just right, play around with the geo to find a setup that suits your driving preferences (I don't think we even know the stock alignment settings for the Emira yet) would all make a good start...

... Having said all that, I do think an Emira would be an 'enjoyable' car to drive on track out the box ... It just depends what you want out of the car, I suppose. I think (and am hoping!) that as a flexible B-road blaster, the Emira will be epic.

For context, I currently have an RX-8 that I have spent a lot of (some might say far too much!) time and money making it as track focussed as possible - As a consequence it is very quick on track, much quicker than any stock RX-8... But it is a bit of a commitment to drive on the road (I drive it on road wheels and tyres to help a little).

 

[VL3X]

On stock trans. Don’t be silly

True. Easy and cheap enough to build though. I don't know why more 2GR Lotus owners don't.

 

[Concept24]

Hmm… pretend being fast by looking fast but effectively being slow is not my cup of tea. To be honest I even find it a bit silly…

Okay and why would it be different for other cars? This applies to all cars equally (maybe except porsche who is sending a team to make sure to achieve the best possible laptimes). So in the end, the Emira just shows poor laptimes so far and I really really really hope this is going to change!

I know its absolutely silly but it would honestly keep me from buying the car, even though it was great fun on b-roads…

I am very looking forward to SportAutos Supertest on nürburgring and Hockenheimring and compare it to equal sportscars. The Evora 400 put down a 7:59 (on UHP) while a 981 GT4 ran a 7:42 (7:32 for 718 GT4). The Exige S V6 had 7:53 and the 380 Cup 7:48 (all numbers on same driver). To be honest, seeing the laptimes so far I could imagine the Emira would even have a hard time beating that Evora time…

You really need a Senna!

 

[Lglotusguy]

I've got a feeling you'd get absolutely bullied by a stock power Miata in an advanced track day with you driving a GT4, GTS 4.0 or an Emira.

I'm trying to be polite and not trying to insult anyone, but from everything you've stated I think you're just better off in a car that gets great advertised Nurburgring lap times or something. You seem more impressed with what someone else could do in your future car than what you could do in it.

I think that's a damn shame, but I recognize we're not all here for the same reasons.

Yeah, speaking for myself as an OK SpecMiata racer (P10 ish out of 40 ish cars, NASA) and porsche owner, we sometimes run DE in our SMT with PCA in the fastest group and are faster than probably half of the porsche cars in the group. We have gt3s giving us the point by. Yes our shitbox cost $35k and we drive 9/10. I respect humble DE drivers looking at improving their skills in a safe environment. The first mod I would recommend is getting proper coaching by a real pro racer and use video and data.

 

[Beachbum]

Theres a guy in the UK that specialises in Lotus Driving course, although will gladly teach anyone. Andy Walsh, for those in the UK that might be interested. He has a very solid reputation