Factory Tour Thread

[SJR202]

I'm doing the factory tour May 9th and I'm hoping to quell one thing that's been in the back of my mind, the quality of the composite panels. One of the reasons I sold my C7 back in 2014 was the horrible surface irregularities the Corvette panels had back then and honestly, even after $$$$$$ spent on a new paint plant in Bowling Green that C8's aren't all that much better. The less than perfect panels combined with orange peel so bad it bordered on fisheye was something I was never happy with. There's just something about a stamped metal panel, be it steel or aluminum, that I've rarely seen replicated in composite.

Can anyone comment on the base quality of the panels and gaps?

I've mentioned this from the tour further up the thread, but nothing to worry about. They've spent so much time on the QA and panels etc including a mulit million pound laser panel checker, it checks every car and every panel on the car including the gaps to a tolerance of some micron i cant remember but it was as good as zero tolerance. EVERY car goes through this scanner, if theres as much as 1/2mm out then it gets sent off to be corrected. All the cars I saw and they are still pre prod mind (dealer/press) had panel quality in both finish and alignment as good as anything you'd find out there at premium brands.

 

[digilotus]

Hi
I have seen the Seneca blue tour car at a Lotus event and Concours D'elegance. I have never owned a blue car, or a Lotus for that matter, never wanted either. When you see it under natural daylight as it was at Concours, its an altogether different experience. From 1 meter away you can see large flecs of silver metallic. Im confident you wont be disappointed, assuming of course the show car colour is representative of the production version. Its darker as opposed candy blue.
Hope this puts your mind at ease
View attachment 4849View attachment 4850View attachment 4851View attachment 4852View attachment 4853
Its really is striking but of course colours are all subjective. See a few pics which i posted last year

They are really good photos with great colour balance! So many bad ones of Seneca out there ranging from baby powder blue through to over saturated gumboot blue.

 

[roundincircles]

I've mentioned this from the tour further up the thread, but nothing to worry about. They've spent so much time on the QA and panels etc including a mulit million pound laser panel checker, it checks every car and every panel on the car including the gaps to a tolerance of some micron i cant remember but it was as good as zero tolerance. EVERY car goes through this scanner, if theres as much as 1/2mm out then it gets sent off to be corrected. All the cars I saw and they are still pre prod mind (dealer/press) had panel quality in both finish and alignment as good as anything you'd find out there at premium brands.

What gets me about those laser fangle dangle measuring machines it deals with ‘built’ assembly , sort of after the event and thus correction is waste/extra cost. Shut lines are a function of pressed/moulded panel to within tolerance and then assembly/fit to correct position…..so get those things right and the final inspection is just a tick box. Toyota refurbish their press tools to maintain panel tolerance before they wear and drift out of tolerance……they have the finest build integrity of the mass producers.

So the zillion pound lazer does nothing for build quality other than confirm what the eye can see……maybe I miss the point!

 

[GetawayDriving]

What's your thought on Hethel Yellow/tan combo?

In my view, the best colors are:
Hethel Yellow
Hethel Yellow
Hethel Yellow

No other color addresses the mid life crisis.

Ha!

No doubt Hethel is a loud, fun, and great looking color. I just wish it didn’t mute the lines of the car so much.

Tan with yellow would not be my choice, but I’m not sure I can articulate why. If I were to get yellow, I think I’d stick with black interior. Just my tastes.

Yellow is just so bold I don’t think it needs additional visual interest from a color interior. I find it a bit too much.

To debate myself though, it’s like mustard and seeds?

 

[GetawayDriving]

Hi
I have seen the Seneca blue tour car at a Lotus event and Concours D'elegance. I have never owned a blue car, or a Lotus for that matter, never wanted either. When you see it under natural daylight as it was at Concours, its an altogether different experience. From 1 meter away you can see large flecs of silver metallic. Im confident you wont be disappointed, assuming of course the show car colour is representative of the production version. Its darker as opposed candy blue.
Hope this puts your mind at ease
View attachment 4849View attachment 4850View attachment 4851View attachment 4852View attachment 4853
Its really is striking but of course colours are all subjective. See a few pics which i posted last year

These photos are very accurate

 

[GetawayDriving]

This is good to hear. I haven't seen Seneca in person, but I ordered it in hopes it was on the darker end of the photos I've seen. Some photos/filters make it look cotton candy blue, which I don't like at all. However, the majority of photos and the sample I saw in person look great.

That’s funny, I was hoping for the opposite. Something closer to Porsche’s miami blue. Based on what I saw it sounds like you’ll be very happy with seneca. It’s a VERY striking color in the flesh.

 

[GetawayDriving]

What gets me about those laser fangle dangle measuring machines it deals with ‘built’ assembly , sort of after the event and thus correction is waste/extra cost. Shut lines are a function of pressed/moulded panel to within tolerance and then assembly/fit to correct position…..so get those things right and the final inspection is just a tick box. Toyota refurbish their press tools to maintain panel tolerance before they wear and drift out of tolerance……they have the finest build integrity of the mass producers.

So the zillion pound lazer does nothing for build quality other than confirm what the eye can see……maybe I miss the point!

There are also these CAD-perfect mock up frames that are used to measure the precise tolerances of pressed parts before they go on the assembly line. So they both test fitment before acceptance, and then the lasers confirm everything is fitting together perfectly when assembled.

 

[andyss]

What gets me about those laser fangle dangle measuring machines it deals with ‘built’ assembly , sort of after the event and thus correction is waste/extra cost. Shut lines are a function of pressed/moulded panel to within tolerance and then assembly/fit to correct position…..so get those things right and the final inspection is just a tick box. Toyota refurbish their press tools to maintain panel tolerance before they wear and drift out of tolerance……they have the finest build integrity of the mass producers.

So the zillion pound lazer does nothing for build quality other than confirm what the eye can see……maybe I miss the point!

True, but they're also using the CMM to monitor the assembly line. On the tour they mentioned monitoring the measurement trends over time to give them advance warning that earlier stages of assembly (or parts from an external supplier) were heading towards the edge of spec so that they can do preventative maintenance (tool changes/machine adjustments etc) *before* it's an issue.

They also said that some of the early measurements they had the CMM take had been already removed from its programming as there was simply no variance worth measuring. This bodes well.

 

[TomAce]

Ha!

No doubt Hethel is a loud, fun, and great looking color. I just wish it didn’t mute the lines of the car so much.

Tan with yellow would not be my choice, but I’m not sure I can articulate why. If I were to get yellow, I think I’d stick with black interior. Just my tastes.

Yellow is just so bold I don’t think it needs additional visual interest from a color interior. I find it a bit too much.

To debate myself though, it’s like mustard and seeds?

Yes, I'm thinking the same. That's why I'm going for Hethel yellow with alcantara with yellow stitching inside. Yellow calipers, too. Although I'm on the fence on switching to black calipers. It will have black wheels though.

I think it is the "raciest" way of configuring the Emira. That's also my concern with all the other colours, except for Seneca blue, maybe. They all are so classy, not like racing yellow or guards red from Porsche, which I absolutely love (guards red).

My dealer told me that his demo cars will have Hethel yellow without black pack (my config) and Seneca blue with black pack. So I will hopefully be able to finalise my decision when seeing those colours in the flesh.

 

[GetawayDriving]

Yes, I'm thinking the same. That's why I'm going for Hethel yellow with alcantara with yellow stitching inside. Yellow calipers, too. Although I'm on the fence on switching to black calipers. It will have black wheels though.

I think it is the "raciest" way of configuring the Emira. That's also my concern with all the other colours, except for Seneca blue, maybe. They all are so classy, not like racing yellow or guards red from Porsche, which I absolutely love (guards red).

My dealer told me that his demo cars will have Hethel yellow without black pack (my config) and Seneca blue with black pack. So I will hopefully be able to finalise my decision when seeing those colours in the flesh.

Agreed, out of all specs the yellow with black+yellow stitch is the raciest.

Close second would be nimbus with red interior and black wheels. That combo is also mean as hell, and very sporting.

 

[TomE]

What gets me about those laser fangle dangle measuring machines it deals with ‘built’ assembly , sort of after the event and thus correction is waste/extra cost. Shut lines are a function of pressed/moulded panel to within tolerance and then assembly/fit to correct position…..so get those things right and the final inspection is just a tick box. Toyota refurbish their press tools to maintain panel tolerance before they wear and drift out of tolerance……they have the finest build integrity of the mass producers.

So the zillion pound lazer does nothing for build quality other than confirm what the eye can see……maybe I miss the point!

Bear in mind the laser machine is one part of an overall production and QA “system”. Other steps in the design, engineering, supply chain and early stages of build are geared towards building a quality car. The measurement is one of many control steps.

They hired a bunch of people from across the industry to help them get it right, including supplier QA people from Bentley for example. Plus Toyota have provided consultancy on production engineering and QA as part of their partnership with Lotus.

 

[Eagle7]

Bear in mind the laser machine is one part of an overall production and QA “system”. Other steps in the design, engineering, supply chain and early stages of build are geared towards building a quality car. The measurement is one of many control steps.

They hired a bunch of people from across the industry to help them get it right, including supplier QA people from Bentley for example. Plus Toyota have provided consultancy on production engineering and QA as part of their partnership with Lotus.

This is good info. Why doesn't Lotus say this? They should be talking about how much effort they're putting into the design and build quality of their cars. That would gain interest and confidence from prospective buyers, especially the Porsche demographic that Lotus wants to appeal to.

 

[NickR]

Bear in mind the laser machine is one part of an overall production and QA “system”. Other steps in the design, engineering, supply chain and early stages of build are geared towards building a quality car. The measurement is one of many control steps.

They hired a bunch of people from across the industry to help them get it right, including supplier QA people from Bentley for example. Plus Toyota have provided consultancy on production engineering and QA as part of their partnership with Lotus.

Indeed. I saw at least 3 QA inspection stops, plus the machine. On top of that they then use a further QA (customer review team?) that sits outside of the normal Q&A team to inspect cars at certain times during a batch run. They have taken QA very seriously!

 

[roundincircles]

Indeed. I saw at least 3 QA inspection stops, plus the machine. On top of that they then use a further QA (customer review team?) that sits outside of the normal Q&A team to inspect cars at certain times during a batch run. They have taken QA very seriously!

I have experience of implementing the Toyota manufacturing system in an many existing factories ( ie, its culture change as opposed to Green field culture establishment). The first action is often to disband QA and fire the managers, who will not accept the change. We then told all the staff that they were accountable for output quality.....at each assembly point....at each machine location. One piece workflow.....if something is not correct then stop assembly, sort it there and then. The staff are the experts.

The question, what are the daily measuring sticks?, establishes behaviour. At Mclaren it was 20 cars per shift.....so they produced 20 irrespective of build integrity......and the dealers put them right or tried to?

Sounds like Lotus are measuring build integrity.....great starting point. On my visit it was clear to see.

 

[VL3X]

Hi
I have seen the Seneca blue tour car at a Lotus event and Concours D'elegance. I have never owned a blue car, or a Lotus for that matter, never wanted either. When you see it under natural daylight as it was at Concours, its an altogether different experience. From 1 meter away you can see large flecs of silver metallic. Im confident you wont be disappointed, assuming of course the show car colour is representative of the production version. Its darker as opposed candy blue.
Hope this puts your mind at ease
View attachment 4849View attachment 4850View attachment 4851View attachment 4852View attachment 4853
Its really is striking but of course colours are all subjective. See a few pics which i posted last year

This is very reassuring. Thank you. The China photos certainly do look like a completely different shade of blue. I'm happy to hear it will look more like the photos you posted.

 

[denk0815]

This is very reassuring. Thank you. The China photos certainly do look like a completely different shade of blue. I'm happy to hear it will look more like the photos you posted.

View attachment 4865

The truth lies somewhere between the two images.
I took the attached picture with my Pixel 6 on a cloudless morning in the salesroom in St Gallen at the end of February. It's very close to what I've seen but tends to be a little darker but my monitor is not calibrated either.

 

[Daz]

Stolen from another group

 

[andyss]

Stolen from another group

oof, that magma looks good outside, even on a cloudy day!

 

[VL3X]

Another shot of Magma in here. All look great!

 

[Daz]

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