How many crossed shopped the GT4?

[DJS]

I've seen the car and it looks amazing, I've heard the car up close and it sounds amazing, we know it is going to drive well due to pre prod car reviews we've seen, then there is the price point, it seems to good to be true, my only worry is the build quality as this remains to be tested, i've had a good look inside and outside of the cars at Hethal and to the eye they looked superb so only time will tell for me on this one.

I'm sure there will be some d... out there that will ruin the car on their review for some reason or another as that's the way it is with most reviews.

I mean £60k to £80k for the Emira! I think we are all onto a winner.

 

[PaulP]

Emira has better suspension (double wishbones vs coilovers), better steering feel (hydraulic vs electric), better exhaust sound (no PPF vs PPF), better manual gear ratios (just right vs too long) and much better looks. Not sure how a GTS is superior.

I think interior and build quality is likely on Porsches side but otherwise I agree

 

[mjw930]

Does already having a 718 Spyder count as cross shopping?

 

[Bilbao-Emira]

Does already having a 718 Spyder count as cross shopping?

View attachment 6230

That's "Shopping Crossed"

 

[vantage]

I had a track-prepped Federal Elise for over 15 years and still own a 981 GT4 since new in 2015. I went to an Emira dealer showing last year.

I think people that have owned both Lotus and Porsche are pretty fair about the differences. A couple of additional things I'd like to point out:

1) My Elise felt like a bucket of bolts, but I love it and that level of quality was acceptable given the lightweight ethos. I didn't even run with the bulkhead cover on mine to save a few pounds. The Emira is a HUGE step up in quality even in pre-production form. But I am skeptical that the materials will be as high as Porsche's. For example if you look at the picture of the 718 paint above, it's excellent. The Emira's body panels are wavy as is typical for fiberglass-bodied cars. When you look really closely at some of the materials and trim, it looks rougher than Porsche. Anyway, this isn't necessarily all that important in a sports car, but worth flagging. I look forward to seeing a production Emira to see how it came out in the end.

2) Evora V6 sounds crazy good. But Porsche flat-6's are a little creamier and sweeter to me and so I think while the Emira engine will be effective, I still prefer a Porsche engine.

3) Handling and steering feel, no need to talk about this, we know which one is better. But this first Emira is trying to be an everyday car, so I do wonder if I should skip it until they come out with a GT version.

4) I've grown to like the GT4's unassuming and refined looks. Doesn't get that much attention. Will have to get used to every tourist taking a picture of me at the gas station again.

 

[NicolasB]

Does already having a 718 Spyder count as cross shopping?

View attachment 6230

Now those are flower wheels! If you did the diamond cut style on these it would really stand out

 

[akhbhaat]

Yeah, as mentioned in the earlier post, I originally went with the GT4 over the Evora in part because of (perceptual) reliability and build quality. And I wasn't disappointed: my car had 30k miles and dozens of track days but still no rattles and zero unscheduled shop visits. Very solid. The number of common issues on that model in general can be counted on one hand: strut towers (only a problem if you're blasting over curbing at the track or hit something else hard), third gear (limited range of cars, fixed under recall; mine wasn't affected), and the door cards or headliners delaminating which is a general 981 problem that primarily happens in hot climates. I also had the (common) squeaky clutch, but otherwise...

Emira looks to be a big step up from the Evora (let alone the Elise et al), but I doubt it will match Porsche in that regard.

3) Handling and steering feel, no need to talk about this, we know which one is better. But this first Emira is trying to be an everyday car, so I do wonder if I should skip it until they come out with a GT version.

I'm also concerned about this. If Emira drives like Evora, good enough. But if they toned it down...

 

[vantage]

I'm also concerned about this. If Emira drives like Evora, good enough. But if they toned it down...

The seats in the shadow grey car had very little lateral bolstering for example, so that's the #1 thing I'll be looking for in Tuesday's reviews.

My Elise started as a touring pack / base suspension car, so I'm not too worried about the rest.

 

[digilotus]

The seats in the shadow grey car had very little lateral bolstering for example, so that's the #1 thing I'll be looking for in Tuesday's reviews.

My Elise started as a touring pack / base suspension car, so I'm not too worried about the rest.

Sitting in the preproduction car a few times recently, the bolstering felt perfect to me. I had no complaints at all about the seat comfort and level of lateral support.

 

[emiraspain]

I had a track-prepped Federal Elise for over 15 years and still own a 981 GT4 since new in 2015. I went to an Emira dealer showing last year.

I think people that have owned both Lotus and Porsche are pretty fair about the differences. A couple of additional things I'd like to point out:

1) My Elise felt like a bucket of bolts, but I love it and that level of quality was acceptable given the lightweight ethos. I didn't even run with the bulkhead cover on mine to save a few pounds. The Emira is a HUGE step up in quality even in pre-production form. But I am skeptical that the materials will be as high as Porsche's. For example if you look at the picture of the 718 paint above, it's excellent. The Emira's body panels are wavy as is typical for fiberglass-bodied cars. When you look really closely at some of the materials and trim, it looks rougher than Porsche. Anyway, this isn't necessarily all that important in a sports car, but worth flagging. I look forward to seeing a production Emira to see how it came out in the end.

2) Evora V6 sounds crazy good. But Porsche flat-6's are a little creamier and sweeter to me and so I think while the Emira engine will be effective, I still prefer a Porsche engine.

3) Handling and steering feel, no need to talk about this, we know which one is better. But this first Emira is trying to be an everyday car, so I do wonder if I should skip it until they come out with a GT version.

4) I've grown to like the GT4's unassuming and refined looks. Doesn't get that much attention. Will have to get used to every tourist taking a picture of me at the gas station again.

regarding point 1, I have not seen the car in person, but many of those who have are porsche or even ferrari owners and in general no one has indicated "wavy" body panels and Lotus hasnt made a fibreglass car for many years, so I would be surprised and amazed if this were true, but again, I have not even seen it in person.
I too have had a 718 and build quality is great, but the interior is 8 years old, so at least 4 years out of date, but yes still good quality. However, while the Evora is even MORE out of date interior wise, I believe most owners are quite happy with the quality, @TomE would give some insight here, but the stitching looks good, seats seemed good quality and nice looking.
Not sure what you refer to in terms of "rougher" than the porsche, the plastics, leather, alcantara?
Im not trying to attack what you said at all, but you are the first person to indicate what seems like a huge panel and interior quality difference, which I am not sure will be the case. I would be happy if Lotus get to 75% of Porsche's level at their first attempt in many years, but only after perhaps 3-6 months will this forum be a place to accurately judge that and I am hoping they got there.
Horses for courses, but any car with a spoiler is not unassuming IMO and yes I had a cup 250 and thats about the only car I would accept with a spoiler, but have to accept it does stand out and a GT4 IMO also stands out more than an S or GTS and a spyder certainly stands out more (beautiful car although also needs a revamp, which it wont get as an ICE version.....)
I agree on handling, if you want the version to compare with the spyder or GT4, you should wait for the more track related version as although I am sure this car will handle very well, it is a more mass ..please everyone car.... like a standard 718 / S and not everyone wants a track beast, I dont quite know what I want .
Engine also, agree more or less, but again, horses for courses...

anyway, just a friendly sunday morning comment

 

[MCS]

Does already having a 718 Spyder count as cross shopping?

View attachment 6230

Porsche have a way of making their GT cars look so much better than the base models. I do love the look of the spyder

 

[emiraspain]

Porsche have a way of making their GT cars look so much better than the base models. I do love the look of the spyder

the spyder is one of those cars that looks even better in person.... Ive wanted one for quite a while, but in the UK cold never quite justify 90k for it and then when it got to the late 718 one..... with the same interior as 2015.... I thought, no.... I'll wait for mission whatever it is and see how that looks.... I like electric now I am used to it.

 

[vantage]

Not sure what you refer to in terms of "rougher" than the porsche, the plastics, leather, alcantara?
Im not trying to attack what you said at all, but you are the first person to indicate what seems like a huge panel and interior quality difference, which I am not sure will be the case. I would be happy if Lotus get to 75% of Porsche's level at their first attempt in many years, but only after perhaps 3-6 months will this forum be a place to accurately judge that and I am hoping they got there.

I would say for sure that the Emira is already 75% of the way there. I didn't say the gap was huge, but it's more than Porsche still has a leg up IMO. But it remains to be seen what the final car looks like. The interior in particular is a huge step up and in general all the main switches etc. felt great. I think you'll be happy overall.

So what did I notice? The pre-prod car had more orange peel and some minor wavyness in the reflection that you can see in many photos online even. Especially the black painted bits (Both inside and outside the car) look a bit "rough", I might even prefer plastic on those. Hard to compare a fiberglass-bodied car to a metal-bodied car in this regard.

Then there were a lot of little pieces on the car that are likely NOT final as I mentioned in my original post. Weather sealing in places reminded me of my Elise with the foam spilling out of the doorsill, the engine surround trim was very roughly cut, etc.

 

[emiraspain]

I would say for sure that the Emira is already 75% of the way there. I didn't say the gap was huge, but it's more than Porsche still has a leg up IMO. But it remains to be seen what the final car looks like. The interior in particular is a huge step up and in general all the main switches etc. felt great. I think you'll be happy overall.

So what did I notice? The pre-prod car had more orange peel and some minor wavyness in the reflection that you can see in many photos online even. Especially the black painted bits (Both inside and outside the car) look a bit "rough", I might even prefer plastic on those. Hard to compare a fiberglass-bodied car to a metal-bodied car in this regard.

Then there were a lot of little pieces on the car that are likely NOT final as I mentioned in my original post. Weather sealing in places reminded me of my Elise with the foam spilling out of the doorsill, the engine surround trim was very roughly cut, etc.

ok understood. Yes I think we will all hold our breath, even after the reviews to be honest and until the 3-6 month mark when we can really say, okay, its a dodo... or I can count on it, it wont let me down... inside or out.

 

[Jon_N]

Not sure Emira is GT4 competitor? Base Cayman or GTS at a push I can see….

 

[Toomanyloti]

This is hands down, the biggest reason Porsche is on my shit list and I will never do business with them. At first, I thought it was just one dealership giving me grief, but after visiting 5 different dealerships across 2 different States, I got fed up with it all.

What a horrible way to do business.

go try buy a Rolex - seems to be same business model and it works as they seem to be selling everything the make

 

[digilotus]

I think the BIG difference here is that you can place an order with Lotus and at a point in time you will get the car and have a pretty good idea of when that may be. With Porsche it will be a thank you but no thank you we don't want your money, or simply pay you lip service and put you on an imaginary waiting list. Ive been in both of those scenarios more than once. That is why I ordered my Emira

Must be region specific. I have no issue with ordering whatever Porsche model I would want (eg GT4RS) in Australia and I’ve never bought or owned one before.

 

[Jon_N]

go try buy a Rolex - seems to be same business model and it works as they seem to be selling everything the make

If demand outstrips supply significantly you need some sort of mechanism? I know my U.K. Porsche dealer is very clear that they now have to feedback to Porsche centrally justification for GT car allocation. They’re trying to remove flippers & protect the brand… seems fair to me that those who are loyal & have purchased multiple vehicles get priority?

Saying that, GT4 allocation is not too difficult… GT3, GT4RS, GT3RS….. like rocking horse sh!t!

They can’t simply produce more GT cars either as they need to keep within overall emissions regulations.

 

[ksegg]

I didn't cross shop at all.

The Emira was the closest thing to my M2 Competition - similar size if not smaller, which I like, similar power, 6MT available, amazing exterior/interior design, etc.

I have never liked the Boxster/Cayman - taste is subjective, but it's a really ugly car to me. Drove a few of them before and it also really didn't wow me; even during full WOT, the engine/exhaust sounds terrible.

 

[Leonard]

Must be region specific. I have no issue with ordering whatever Porsche model I would want (eg GT4RS) in Australia and I’ve never bought or owned one before.

If that is the case, go buy a GT4RS immediately