📓 Journals Adding Lightness

[Hell4Leather]

Pretty sure he is referencing performance and raw race car feeling. The Emira is softer and less performance based GT car. That is why they sold more not because it performs better.

Also, the obvious……Lotus manufacturing was different with the Evora and they could only make so many. You can’t sell what you couldn’t make.

 

[Eagle7]

Pretty sure he is referencing performance and raw race car feeling. The Emira is softer and less performance based GT car. That is why they sold more not because it performs better.

The claim of 'performance' has to include the context. If the context is "as light as possible with only those compromises necessary to be street legal" then yes, the first edition Emira has "less performance" than the final edition after 11 years of the Evora. However that was not the context for the design and development of the very first edition of the Emira. It was designed to be a more complete car for the road, including the typical conveniences people like and want for regular street use, while incorporating as much of the performance capability they could for the price point it was aimed at (which was MUCH lower than an Evora). In that regard, the Emira is a better car within that context than the Evora and the sales volume shows that. It includes much more than the Evora, and feels much more like a real car; a grown up Lotus that's quite streetable and can easily be used as a daily driver. And they did it for much less than an Evora, especially when you inflation adjust the prices.

It's not a GT; it's a genuine two-seater which makes it a sports car. The Evora was actually the GT (on paper anyways). Considering the amount of regulations they had to meet with the Emira they did NOT have to meet with the Evora, it's amazing they got its weight (especially for the fully-loaded First Edition) as close to the final edition Evora as they did.

It won't really take all that much to make the Emira perform as well if not better than the Evora for those who want that, but there's no practical way to make an Evora have all that the Emira has. In my mind, that makes it a better car overall, especially for the context for which it was designed. To parrot something Harry Metcalf said (even though he sold his car for reasons I don't think had anything to do with the car), this is the Lotus I've always wanted. I truly believe and feel it's the best Lotus they've ever made.

It would be fantastic if it were the beginning of a new dawn of ICE Lotus cars, but it isn't unfortunately. I'm glad they made it though, and consider it a privilege and blessing to own one.

 

[Dino]

Comparing Emira to Evora is akin to comparing Sofia Vergara to Martha Stewart. Martha can cook. Sofia does not cook (I assume). Martha can clean. Sofia does not want to clean (I assume).
I'm happy for the guys who chose Martha. I choose Sofia. I know, I'm shallow.

 

[LuckysDad]

Titanium lug bolts saves a pound and a half....

 

[Green]

The claim of 'performance' has to include the context. If the context is "as light as possible with only those compromises necessary to be street legal" then yes, the first edition Emira has "less performance" than the final edition after 11 years of the Evora. However that was not the context for the design and development of the very first edition of the Emira. It was designed to be a more complete car for the road, including the typical conveniences people like and want for regular street use, while incorporating as much of the performance capability they could for the price point it was aimed at (which was MUCH lower than an Evora). In that regard, the Emira is a better car within that context than the Evora and the sales volume shows that. It includes much more than the Evora, and feels much more like a real car; a grown up Lotus that's quite streetable and can easily be used as a daily driver. And they did it for much less than an Evora, especially when you inflation adjust the prices.

It's not a GT; it's a genuine two-seater which makes it a sports car. The Evora was actually the GT (on paper anyways). Considering the amount of regulations they had to meet with the Emira they did NOT have to meet with the Evora, it's amazing they got its weight (especially for the fully-loaded First Edition) as close to the final edition Evora as they did.

It won't really take all that much to make the Emira perform as well if not better than the Evora for those who want that, but there's no practical way to make an Evora have all that the Emira has. In my mind, that makes it a better car overall, especially for the context for which it was designed. To parrot something Harry Metcalf said (even though he sold his car for reasons I don't think had anything to do with the car), this is the Lotus I've always wanted. I truly believe and feel it's the best Lotus they've ever made.

It would be fantastic if it were the beginning of a new dawn of ICE Lotus cars, but it isn't unfortunately. I'm glad they made it though, and consider it a privilege and blessing to own one.

No arguments on looks for sure. I still think it is one of the best looking cars on the road. If Lotus came out with an official company response on the paint issues I will probably order one. The paint issue was the only reason I canceled. That issue was just too far for me to go. I will say the Evora had the higher horsepower models that clearly out perform the Emira. She is a beauty though.

 

[Eagle7]

No arguments on looks for sure. I still think it is one of the best looking cars on the road. If Lotus came out with an official company response on the paint issues I will probably order one. The paint issue was the only reason I canceled. That issue was just too far for me to go. I will say the Evora had the higher horsepower models that clearly out perform the Emira. She is a beauty though.

Since U.S. dealers are now starting to have some models in stock, you could check them out on the showroom floor for any paint issues. There doesn't seem to be very many reporting paint issues; a very very small number have reported this so the odds are greatly in your favor that you'll be able to find a car that you like.

As far as the Evora, I did some additional research and here's the issue with it being a better car (or not) than the Emira. I got these numbers from Car and Driver with their 2021 test of the Evora GT.

Here's their spec list:

You'll note they show a list (base or starting) price of $98,945 in U.S. dollars for the car they tested, but the price as tested was $131,795 and that was in 2021. Going with the base price of $98,845, using an inflation adjustment calculator, that would be the equivalent of $114,721 in today's dollars, and that would be for the BASE MODEL; no extras.

Now take a look at the inflation adjusted value of their "price as tested" figure of $131,795 which included the carbon package and other goodies. That would cost you $152,809 in today's dollars, so comparing the performance of the last Evoras to the first edition Emira doesn't really give you the complete picture of what a value the Emira actually is.

Considering that the BASE model Evora at that time would be $114,958 in today's dollars, compared to an Emira FE loaded with all the options at $107,000.... the Emira FE is really quite a deal. Especially when it's stacked up against their "price as tested" version which would be $152,809 in today's dollars. For the difference of $45k, I guarantee you can take an Emira FE and make it outperform that Evora, and STILL have a good chunk of change left over. Dollar value for dollar value, the Emira is really pretty darned impressive.

The V6 FE is only 16 hp less than the Evora they tested, and I've already made that up just by installing the Eventuri. The curb weight of 3,112 lbs is the biggest advantage of the Evora. Stock mine weighed 3,270. I have the V6 with manual and leather interior. That puts me at a 158 lb disadvantage against the Evora they tested (which had the carbon pack). I've already removed 30 lbs with the Antigravity battery. The wheels I got (which I haven't installed yet) will be about 16 lbs lighter than stock, which will put me at 46 lbs lighter total, so now I'm within 112 lbs of the Evora. If I get GRP's titanium exhaust, that'll peel off about another 17 lbs for a total of 63 lbs of weight reduction. The titanium exhaust should add some power too, so I'm guessing with the Eventuri I'll be somewhere around 425 hp; 8 more than the Evora. Now I'm within 95 lbs of their $152K Evora and I'll have spent just under an extra $8k to get there. I got mine at the original grandfathered price of $94k, so even with the mods I'll still be less than the current MSRP of the V6 FE with manual.

The Evora's weight-to-power (W/P) ratio (the one they tested) was 7.48. With the mods I listed above, giving me a curb weight of 3,207 and an estimated hp of 425, I'll have a W/P ratio of 7.54. That's pretty darned close for $43k less than their Evora (a 2023 C8 3LT Z51 has a W/P ratio of 7.57 for $100k, just for comparison). The power gain from the titanium exhaust may even be a bit more (I'm guessing an increase of 8 hp). But even still, with even a minimal tune, or removing 66 lbs with Tillet seats, or several other possibilities, I've got that Evora beat. If I get the minimal 430 hp tune, combined with the mods I have I'd be somewhere around 450 hp. That would give me a W/P ratio of 7.12. If I skip the tune and just switch to Tillet seats, saving another 66 lbs, I'm at 3,141 lbs and a W/P ratio of 7.39. If I go crazy and get the tune AND the seats, now I have a W/P ratio of 6.98. The tune and seats would cost as much as all the other mods I've listed, but I'd still be way under the cost of the Evora they tested.

I'm not planning on the tune or seats, but that just gives you an idea of what can be done to more than offset the performance of the Evora for a lot less than what the Evora cost (yes I know you can buy them used for less, but I'm comparing new to new). Even still, just with what I've got in the works, performance-wise I'll be close enough for government work, and with all the looks and conveniences the Emira has.

If you look at it objectively and realistically, there's really no comparison. This is not to say anything bad about the Evora. When it came out 14 years ago, it was quite the car, but times and technology have changed, and the Emira is really the most state-of-the-art ICE sports car Lotus has ever produced. As a starting platform, with a few mods it's truly amazing.

 

[niterida7]

We have ridiculously hot weather right now, so I'm not out driving. We've had 100+ for the las

Well said Eagle7

If you look at it objectively and realistically, there's really no comparison. This is not to say anything bad about the Evora. When it came out 14 years ago, it was quite the car, but times and technology have changed, and the Emira is really the most state-of-the-art ICE sports car Lotus has ever produced. As a starting platform, with a few mods it's truly amazing.

Perfectly stated, I plan on doing as many upgrades possible to get the w/p as low as possible.

 

[ToonFan]

Since U.S. dealers are now starting to have some models in stock, you could check them out on the showroom floor for any paint issues. There doesn't seem to be very many reporting paint issues; a very very small number have reported this so the odds are greatly in your favor that you'll be able to find a car that you like.

As far as the Evora, I did some additional research and here's the issue with it being a better car (or not) than the Emira. I got these numbers from Car and Driver with their 2021 test of the Evora GT.

Here's their spec list:

View attachment 47862

You'll note they show a list (base or starting) price of $98,945 in U.S. dollars for the car they tested, but the price as tested was $131,795 and that was in 2021. Going with the base price of $98,845, using an inflation adjustment calculator, that would be the equivalent of $114,721 in today's dollars, and that would be for the BASE MODEL; no extras.

View attachment 47865

Now take a look at the inflation adjusted value of their "price as tested" figure of $131,795 which included the carbon package and other goodies. That would cost you $152,809 in today's dollars, so comparing the performance of the last Evoras to the first edition Emira doesn't really give you the complete picture of what a value the Emira actually is.

View attachment 47864

Considering that the BASE model Evora at that time would be $114,958 in today's dollars, compared to an Emira FE loaded with all the options at $107,000.... the Emira FE is really quite a deal. Especially when it's stacked up against their "price as tested" version which would be $152,809 in today's dollars. For the difference of $45k, I guarantee you can take an Emira FE and make it outperform that Evora, and STILL have a good chunk of change left over. Dollar value for dollar value, the Emira is really pretty darned impressive.

The V6 FE is only 16 hp less than the Evora they tested, and I've already made that up just by installing the Eventuri. The curb weight of 3,112 lbs is the biggest advantage of the Evora. Stock mine weighed 3,270. I have the V6 with manual and leather interior. That puts me at a 158 lb disadvantage against the Evora they tested (which had the carbon pack). I've already removed 30 lbs with the Antigravity battery. The wheels I got (which I haven't installed yet) will be about 16 lbs lighter than stock, which will put me at 46 lbs lighter total, so now I'm within 112 lbs of the Evora. If I get GRP's titanium exhaust, that'll peel off about another 17 lbs for a total of 63 lbs of weight reduction. The titanium exhaust should add some power too, so I'm guessing with the Eventuri I'll be somewhere around 425 hp; 8 more than the Evora. Now I'm within 95 lbs of their $152K Evora and I'll have spent just under an extra $8k to get there. I got mine at the original grandfathered price of $94k, so even with the mods I'll still be less than the current MSRP of the V6 FE with manual.

The Evora's weight-to-power (W/P) ratio (the one they tested) was 7.48. With the mods I listed above, giving me a curb weight of 3,207 and an estimated hp of 425, I'll have a W/P ratio of 7.54. That's pretty darned close for $43k less than their Evora (a 2023 C8 3LT Z51 has a W/P ratio of 7.57 for $100k, just for comparison). The power gain from the titanium exhaust may even be a bit more (I'm guessing an increase of 8 hp). But even still, with even a minimal tune, or removing 66 lbs with Tillet seats, or several other possibilities, I've got that Evora beat. If I get the minimal 430 hp tune, combined with the mods I have I'd be somewhere around 450 hp. That would give me a W/P ratio of 7.12. If I skip the tune and just switch to Tillet seats, saving another 66 lbs, I'm at 3,141 lbs and a W/P ratio of 7.39. If I go crazy and get the tune AND the seats, now I have a W/P ratio of 6.98. The tune and seats would cost as much as all the other mods I've listed, but I'd still be way under the cost of the Evora they tested.

I'm not planning on the tune or seats, but that just gives you an idea of what can be done to more than offset the performance of the Evora for a lot less than what the Evora cost (yes I know you can buy them used for less, but I'm comparing new to new). Even still, just with what I've got in the works, performance-wise I'll be close enough for government work, and with all the looks and conveniences the Emira has.

If you look at it objectively and realistically, there's really no comparison. This is not to say anything bad about the Evora. When it came out 14 years ago, it was quite the car, but times and technology have changed, and the Emira is really the most state-of-the-art ICE sports car Lotus has ever produced. As a starting platform, with a few mods it's truly amazing.

Nailed It!

 

[Eagle7]

I've been trying to get things done on the car, but we've been in an unbelievable heat wave. It's literally been over 100 degrees every single day for over 3 weeks, and the forecast says it's going to continue for another week at least. I've been trying to get up very early in the morning to work on the car, but even at 6 a.m. it's 85 in the garage, and in minutes there's sweat dripping off my forehead into my glasses and I can't see.

I got the wheels from Aerie last Monday. They're the same size and specs as the Lotus factory wheels.

The front wheel weighs 24 lbs. which is a bit heavier than I was expecting, but the rear wheel makes up for it.

The rear wheel is only 9 ounces heavier.

The stock wheels with tire, TPMS, wheel weights and everything are:

Front = 49 lbs 13 oz

Rear = 55 lbs. 15.2 oz, or basically 56 lbs.

 

[Eagle7]

I had them make a simulated center lock for the wheel center cap, and all 4 of those weigh 13.8 oz, so about 3 1/2 oz each. They screw into the center of the rim.

Here they are with the center caps in them. Basically 4 oz each.

Here's a pic of one wheel with the center cap and the titanium lug bolts. Tomorrow I'm going early over to Discount Tire and have them switch the tires over from the stock wheels to these.

Right now the car is up in the air on the Quickjack. I still have to do the oil changes for the engine and transaxle, and look into removing the wheel well liners and see about putting dampening material on them. It's just so freaking hot I can only work for about 30 minutes in the early morning before I'm drenched in sweat and have to stop. I just have to persist and do what I can as I can.

 

[Hell4Leather]

Agreed! Adds some bling back there.

I’m doing that with the stock intake. Looks great

 

[Hell4Leather]

You can get 2/3rds of this intake power gain by removing the gauze off the front of the stock air filter. Dyno tested and confirmed on two Emira's so far.

Zero. Same for deleting the entire muffler. That actually lost power on mine.

Aaron
ATS Racing and Exotics

I’ve seen vacuum tests that refute that claim about the Cold Climate filter (the foam add on). It reduces very little intake and if you think about it here’s why:

The Emira is not Naturally Aspirated. The air box is designed with extra surface area beyond what is needed. The forced induction surpasses what limited losses you get from the addition of a snow filter.

You don’t gain 15 Hp just because you remove the filter. I suspect I could blow an industrial fan directly into the intake with no filter and see no difference.

 

[Hell4Leather]

Since U.S. dealers are now starting to have some models in stock, you could check them out on the showroom floor for any paint issues. There doesn't seem to be very many reporting paint issues; a very very small number have reported this so the odds are greatly in your favor that you'll be able to find a car that you like.

As far as the Evora, I did some additional research and here's the issue with it being a better car (or not) than the Emira. I got these numbers from Car and Driver with their 2021 test of the Evora GT.

Here's their spec list:

View attachment 47862

You'll note they show a list (base or starting) price of $98,945 in U.S. dollars for the car they tested, but the price as tested was $131,795 and that was in 2021. Going with the base price of $98,845, using an inflation adjustment calculator, that would be the equivalent of $114,721 in today's dollars, and that would be for the BASE MODEL; no extras.

View attachment 47865

Now take a look at the inflation adjusted value of their "price as tested" figure of $131,795 which included the carbon package and other goodies. That would cost you $152,809 in today's dollars, so comparing the performance of the last Evoras to the first edition Emira doesn't really give you the complete picture of what a value the Emira actually is.

View attachment 47864

Considering that the BASE model Evora at that time would be $114,958 in today's dollars, compared to an Emira FE loaded with all the options at $107,000.... the Emira FE is really quite a deal. Especially when it's stacked up against their "price as tested" version which would be $152,809 in today's dollars. For the difference of $45k, I guarantee you can take an Emira FE and make it outperform that Evora, and STILL have a good chunk of change left over. Dollar value for dollar value, the Emira is really pretty darned impressive.

The V6 FE is only 16 hp less than the Evora they tested, and I've already made that up just by installing the Eventuri. The curb weight of 3,112 lbs is the biggest advantage of the Evora. Stock mine weighed 3,270. I have the V6 with manual and leather interior. That puts me at a 158 lb disadvantage against the Evora they tested (which had the carbon pack). I've already removed 30 lbs with the Antigravity battery. The wheels I got (which I haven't installed yet) will be about 16 lbs lighter than stock, which will put me at 46 lbs lighter total, so now I'm within 112 lbs of the Evora. If I get GRP's titanium exhaust, that'll peel off about another 17 lbs for a total of 63 lbs of weight reduction. The titanium exhaust should add some power too, so I'm guessing with the Eventuri I'll be somewhere around 425 hp; 8 more than the Evora. Now I'm within 95 lbs of their $152K Evora and I'll have spent just under an extra $8k to get there. I got mine at the original grandfathered price of $94k, so even with the mods I'll still be less than the current MSRP of the V6 FE with manual.

The Evora's weight-to-power (W/P) ratio (the one they tested) was 7.48. With the mods I listed above, giving me a curb weight of 3,207 and an estimated hp of 425, I'll have a W/P ratio of 7.54. That's pretty darned close for $43k less than their Evora (a 2023 C8 3LT Z51 has a W/P ratio of 7.57 for $100k, just for comparison). The power gain from the titanium exhaust may even be a bit more (I'm guessing an increase of 8 hp). But even still, with even a minimal tune, or removing 66 lbs with Tillet seats, or several other possibilities, I've got that Evora beat. If I get the minimal 430 hp tune, combined with the mods I have I'd be somewhere around 450 hp. That would give me a W/P ratio of 7.12. If I skip the tune and just switch to Tillet seats, saving another 66 lbs, I'm at 3,141 lbs and a W/P ratio of 7.39. If I go crazy and get the tune AND the seats, now I have a W/P ratio of 6.98. The tune and seats would cost as much as all the other mods I've listed, but I'd still be way under the cost of the Evora they tested.

I'm not planning on the tune or seats, but that just gives you an idea of what can be done to more than offset the performance of the Evora for a lot less than what the Evora cost (yes I know you can buy them used for less, but I'm comparing new to new). Even still, just with what I've got in the works, performance-wise I'll be close enough for government work, and with all the looks and conveniences the Emira has.

If you look at it objectively and realistically, there's really no comparison. This is not to say anything bad about the Evora. When it came out 14 years ago, it was quite the car, but times and technology have changed, and the Emira is really the most state-of-the-art ICE sports car Lotus has ever produced. As a starting platform, with a few mods it's truly amazing.

Not sure where they got the 8.2 seconds in 30-50mph. They forget to accelerate or something?

 

[Time2Fly]

I had them make a simulated center lock for the wheel center cap, and all 4 of those weigh 13.8 oz, so about 3 1/2 oz each. They screw into the center of the rim.

View attachment 47996

Here they are with the center caps in them. Basically 4 oz each.

View attachment 47997

Here's a pic of one wheel with the center cap and the titanium lug bolts. Tomorrow I'm going early over to Discount Tire and have them switch the tires over from the stock wheels to these.

View attachment 47998

Right now the car is up in the air on the Quickjack. I still have to do the oil changes for the engine and transaxle, and look into removing the wheel well liners and see about putting dampening material on them. It's just so freaking hot I can only work for about 30 minutes in the early morning before I'm drenched in sweat and have to stop. I just have to persist and do what I can as I can.

Does that bring the centerlock flush with the spokes?

Either way it looks great! @Aerie knocked it out of the park

 

[Eagle7]

Does that bring the centerlock flush with the spokes?

Either way it looks great! @Aerie knocked it out of the park

Yes.

 

[Speedy Emira]

Can we finally put to bed:
Emira is a lesser car than the Evora and the i4 will be superior for its tunability.
Gains are possible. Add lightness.
Its a special car across the board. Void the warranty all you want and enjoy the drive. I am.

Sorry I didn’t read the latter posts on this thread. I can’t say I agree the Emira is a lessor car that the Evora or that the I4 will be more tunable.
I don’t want to offend owners of either of the above mentioned models because they are both superb. No point debating the the Evora as a past model because times have moved on and we are lucky Lotus bother having another petrol car at all.
I really hope the i4 is a great car but I don’t believe for a second it will be more unable for a second. My mates AMG A45S went bang on a 500hp tune and the crank failed 4000 miles after a built engine running 620hp.
JUBU have successfully ran 750hp builds on the V6. There is no way a 2.0 is ever going to get to the same level and certainly not in a mid engine car with all the issues regarding heat.

 

[Eagle7]

After getting the tires switched over from the factory rims to the Aerie rims, I now have the weights of the wheels as they are on the car. This includes tires, TPMS, mounted and balanced.

The factory wheels with Goodyear tires are:
Fronts = 49.81 lbs each, or 99.61 lbs for the pair
Rears = 56 lbs each, or 112 lbs for the pair
This is a total of 221.63 lbs of weight for all 4 factory wheels with everything.

The Aerie wheels with Goodyear tires are:
Fronts = 46.32 lbs each, or 92.64 lbs for the pair
Rears = 47.76 lbs each, or 95.52 lbs for the pair
This is a total of 188.16 lbs of weight for all 4 Aerie wheels with everything.

This is a total savings of 23.47 lbs of unsprung rotating weight for the entire set, which is very good.

Here's the new spreadsheet that shows the most current and accurate numbers I have for everything. The car's stock weight is calculated based on the actual measured weight of 3,240 lbs, which was with the Antigravity battery. I added the difference in weight between the factory and Antigravity battery, to get the car's factory stock weight. This was with a full tank of gas.

The HP from the factory is 400 which is at the crank, and the 417.86 I have is the calculated addition at the crank from the Eventuri, which added 16.5 hp to the rear wheels. By adding in the drivetrain loss factor of 7.6%, I calculated the Eventuri added 17.6 hp at the crank. I did this strictly for the weight-to-power (W/P) calculation which is usually based on the crank HP.

The wheels (x2) are the weights with everything, tires and all. The difference in weight between the factory lug bolts and the titanium ones are also included.

The Eventuri is a half pound lighter than stock which doesn't make any practical difference at all, but I included it just to be thorough.

At the bottom is the calculated weight of 3,215.15 lbs my car should now have, which gives me a W/P ratio of 7.69 with a full tank of gas. After I get everything put back together, I'll run over to the weight scale and get an actual weight, but it should be pretty close. (I still have to do the oil change and look at the wheel well liners, but it was 107 yesterday and it's supposed to be 107 again today. It's been like this for almost 4 weeks. The garage never cools off below 85 so the heat is just killin' me.)

If I can get a video of what GRP's titanium exhaust sounds like with the 3rd cat installed (no delete), and it's reasonably within the volume level of the factory exhaust, I'll get it. That would save another 16.8 lbs, which would get my car just under 3,200 lbs at 3,198. Assuming it would add just 7 hp, that would put me at a W/P ratio of 7.53 which is right at what a C8 3LT/Z51 is. This would be with a factory stock engine, and all 3 cats in place. Not bad!

 

[FlyNavy01]

Not sure where they got the 8.2 seconds in 30-50mph. They forget to accelerate or something?

That's top gear acceleration. Car and Driver has been doing that test for many years.

 

[VL3X]

FWIW @Eagle7, RAYS ENGINEERING stated for every 2.2lbs of weight eliminated from unsprung weight is equal to eliminating 33lbs of overall vehicle weight that your suspension has to manage. So, (23.47/2.2) x 33 = ~352 lbs of reduced weight off suspension with your new wheels!

I know this isn't an exact science, but a useful formula I've been using for my own vehicle mod calculations.

 

[Hell4Leather]

That's top gear acceleration. Car and Driver has been doing that test for many years.

I know the test, it’s not the correct time. It doesn’t take 8.2 seconds to reach 50mph from 30mph. The Toyota Camry does it 4. You mean the supercharged version takes twice as long……