Jethro addresses 'the review'

Not sure if this has been posted elsewhere. Just catching up with my EVO reading and saw Jethro addresses the claims of Porsche bias and corruption!
I think he just called YOU a nutter

 

[kitkat]

Wait you mean a caged non street legal car built solely for competition shouldn’t be compared with a production street car??? That’s just crazy talk lol

Personally I think the gt4 Porsche and the evora gt were direct competitors, so it would be crazy NOT to compare the emira to one, but I guess we should only compare it to cars it can beat lol

I mean I was certainly cross-shopping between the Emira and the 718 GT4. To further your argument, the Lotus dealer I put my deposit down with had a 718 GT4 that was traded in for an Evora GT.

I absolutely compare the Emira to it even though many here don’t welcome the comparison. Both are similar in weight, the Emira was originally rumored at roughly the same power and torque, the sport chassis touts its track worthiness and comes with cup2s just like the GT4, and both market their aero development. I simply view the Emira as a better value albeit slightly less performant competitor to the GT4.

 

[Leonard]

yes, but I like the sound of the V6 and while I am sure the iphone 4 will have a good sound, will it be AS good? And I would get lazy and leave it in auto all the time and then I would ask myself, why do I have this car.
Im sticking v6, but would like to drive and compare the i4 out of curiosity and I think.... I estimate...I may be wrong, but the base price of 60k.... well, I think it may be 65 in no time at all, with no extras.

Correct again these are the conundrums....

 

[Leonard]

At the end of the day we can compare anything with anything, but the standard emira is not aimed at the gt4 customer, so I think its a waste of time comparing, clearly it will lose, but if your customer is a 60 year old guy who wants a softer ride, no shouty spoiler and quieter inside, then a touring emira would presumably win him over, over the gt4.

Exactly!! This is me!!!!

Lotus #fortheOAPs

 

[jmn444]

I absolutely compare the Emira to it even though many here don’t welcome the comparison. Both are similar in weight, the Emira was originally rumored at roughly the same power and torque, the sport chassis touts its track worthiness and comes with cup2s just like the GT4, and both market their aero development. I simply view the Emira as a better value albeit slightly less performant competitor to the GT4.

Exactly.

 

[jmn444]

I would love to know what the lap time of a sport suspension, cup tire Emira vs a GT4 with Jethro behind the wheel?

It shouldn’t be far off. But I also am not as familiar with the newer version of the gt4. The older one and the evora gt were quite close with the same driver and seemed to boil down to which had the fresher tires.

 

[Lotustoronto]

It shouldn’t be far off. But I also am not as familiar with the newer version of the gt4. The older one and the evora gt were quite close with the same driver and seemed to boil down to which had the fresher tires.

If the Emira in sport suspension and cup tires gets very close to the GT4 on track (v6 manual vs Flat 6 Manual).... well let's just say I would be extremely impressed. It would be a HUGE win for Lotus. I think they will beat the GT4 track times in the more track focused versions coming later, I am sure that is one of their goals.

 

[Honeywell]

I’m a little bit confused by all these GT4 comments from you.

You do know that Emira GT4 already exists and is orderable right? It also shouldn’t be in any way compared to a standard Porsche GT4.

As for Jethro’s driving qualifications: how many Nürburgring 24 Hour races have you won and in which class?

Jethro Bovingdon | Racing career profile | Driver Database

www.driverdb.com

He's OK. No god.

He has a Looooooooooonh legacy as a Porsche and BMW fan boy.

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If long geared stiffly suspended Ring machines are his kink then good luck to him. A Lotus Esprit for the 21st century ain't going to float the Bovingdon float. To Evo magazines advertising editors expense account.

 

[jmn444]

If the Emira in sport suspension and cup tires gets very close to the GT4 on track (v6 manual vs Flat 6 Manual).... well let's just say I would be extremely impressed. It would be a HUGE win for Lotus. I think they will beat the GT4 track times in the more track focused versions coming later, I am sure that is one of their goals.

Just did some googling and sounds like biggest cause of lap time gain on the 718 is stickier cup 2s, so IF lotus’s claim of the emira being quicker around hethel than the evora (assuming they mean the gt/latest model), then it should be just putting the cars on the same compound tires to get them close.

It’s amazing how much faster gt350r cup 2s are vs gt350 cup 2s, at least on the 1st day of use, so it’s clear manufacturers are putting a lot of effort into getting insanely sticky tires to hit these performance goals.

Time will tell, there are always gt4’s at the track it seems so should be lots of opportunity to benchmark them even if media doesn’t do a back to back.

 

[Adam Brouillard]

I looked into the alignment specs and it looks like Porsche specs a lot more caster than Lotus does. Higher than most cars actually. Especially on their GT cars. This gives the steering a very heavy centered feel. Lotus seems on the lower end of the spectrum which gives a lighter centered feeling and reacts to surface changes more.

Not saying either is necessarily better as it depends what a driver wants, but it would explain how this reviewer would say the Lotus front end was "soft." It looked like he was able to get oversteer without too much effort so it doesn't seem like the Lotus has a particularly understeering setup. You could reduce understeer a bit pretty easily anyway with just going with more negative camber up front as most street cars are specced for tire longevity on the roads, not ultimate grip on track. For instance, the GT4 has much more camber than the standard versions. Only recommended if you track it a bunch though unless you just like buying tires more often.

 

[jmn444]

Caster is more important in strut cars than sla cars since they generally don’t have a camber gain on compression like sla cars do. How much are they running?

Same with static camber but I totally agree that those setting make a ton of difference.

 

[Adam Brouillard]

Caster is more important in strut cars than sla cars since they generally don’t have a camber gain on compression like sla cars do. How much are they running?

Same with static camber but I totally agree that those setting make a ton of difference.

Porsche was like 9-10 degrees. Older lotus cars were more like 4-5, so assuming they are going with the same philosophy. Would also explain the steering feedback we are seeing in reviews.

 

[jmn444]

Caster is more important in strut cars than sla cars since they generally don’t have a camber gain on compression like sla cars do. How much are they running?

Porsche was like 9-10 degrees. Older lotus cars were more like 4-5, so assuming they are going with the same philosophy. Would also explain the steering feedback we are seeing in reviews.

Wow that is a lot. Gt350r spec is 7.88 and that’s pretty high too haha.

I’d be curious now how much gain lotus gets on compression, they have to be relying on the roll gain quite a bit.

 

[kitkat]

Porsche was like 9-10 degrees. Older lotus cars were more like 4-5, so assuming they are going with the same philosophy. Would also explain the steering feedback we are seeing in reviews.

Around 5.5 degrees on the later Evoras with almost another degree of caster possible via the eccentric bolt on the inboard lower control arm. I think however it reduced static negative camber when dialing in more caster. Can probably also adjust it via shims at the upper mount.

 

[emiraspain]

Around 5.5 degrees on the later Evoras with almost another degree of caster possible via the eccentric bolt on the inboard lower control arm. I think however it reduced static negative camber when dialing in more caster. Can probably also adjust it via shims at the upper mount.

no comment except:

 

[Porter]

Around 5.5 degrees on the later Evoras with almost another degree of caster possible via the eccentric bolt on the inboard lower control arm. I think however it reduced static negative camber when dialing in more caster. Can probably also adjust it via shims at the upper mount.

Makes sense that they could dial a bit of static camber back out, if they were increasing caster to get the additional camber gain mid corner and got the target they wanted even with a lower static value. Saves tires a bit and prioritizes steering feel.

 

[Schumacher]

The Emira was never going to be on the level of a Porsche. It is a flawed car with good looks. I was really excited for this car, but it is quickly dying. I don't even think I will bother with another sports car.

 

[Leonard]

The Emira was never going to be on the level of a Porsche. It is a flawed car with good looks. I was really excited for this car, but it is quickly dying. I don't even think I will bother with another sports car.

Go whole hog the other way and get a Rivian pick up....?

 

[Hedge]

Jethro is aligned to Sutcliffe, Catchpole & Meaden. On the other side we have Harry & Harris (not driven the later press car). They all know their stuff. Harry & Harris are also both very sentimental towards Lotus.

That’s 4-2 in the ‘Emira doesn’t steer as well as previous Lotus cars of the past 20 years’ camp.

Given its 3 months of more since those cars were built (and production cars not finished yet) then there must be some chance that Lotus have addressed the handling/damping points?

On the other hand 90% of the time 90% of us won’t notice the handling/damping’ opportunities’. But these are THE Lotus qualities that matter, aren’t they?

 

[Leonard]

On the other hand 90% of the time 90% of us won’t notice the handling/damping’ opportunities’. But these are THE Lotus qualities that matter, aren’t they?

Is that 60% of the time it works every time #sexpanther
Frankel was in the former camp as well.
I hope Lotus have taken the feedback on board and are using these delays to tweak the geometry a little and sharpen everything up. Unless ots just the extra weight taking the shine off, but then it's still not a complete lard arse..

 

[Eagle7]

The Emira was never going to be on the level of a Porsche. It is a flawed car with good looks. I was really excited for this car, but it is quickly dying. I don't even think I will bother with another sports car.

Flawed in what way, and for what purpose? It's a street sports car designed for a price point of £59,995. What were you expecting?