Emira looks

[Wolfram]

Depends what you mean by doing 'something right'. Recognising there trickle down economy does not work, and rich people are getting richer is not in my eyes doing right. How many of those 11155 ferraris will hit race track? I suspect 10%, some will be used as daily driver to show status, and some end up in private collection. That is doing something right? I think Toyota GR Yaris or GR86 is doing something right. Those cars will be driven as they should be, not spending most of the time being polished.

Regarding Lotus, it is a wider problem in the UK. Manufacture is not getting enough support from local investors or government. Foreign monies needs to come, for Lotus to design new cars. Good thing is this investor want to maintain Lotus as much as possible and bring it to the future.

Germany and US, had different mindset regarding manufacture hence UK motor industry stayed behind. Alpine is Renault sport brand, so they have hedge monies behind. 110 great car, shame it is so ugly. KTM? BAC? you can not use them everyday. Toys.

Delays are a problem but... corvid, semiconductors shortage, war in Ukraine, trade war with China and.... lotus own changes - new factory, meaning that yes, there will be frustration due to delays.

Ferrari have a 2+ year wait list for their cars at their current prices. They're building at capacity. Lotus are planning on selling roughly half the number of sports cars Ferrari does, at around 1/3 the price. And you seriously think Ferrari should ditch their current market strategy and develop a cheaper car?

I wonder what proportion of Emiras will ever be taken on the track..?

 

[kenniGT]

Ferrari have a 2+ year wait list for their cars at their current prices. They're building at capacity. Lotus are planning on selling roughly half the number of sports cars Ferrari does, at around 1/3 the price. And you seriously think Ferrari should ditch their current market strategy and develop a cheaper car?

I wonder what proportion of Emiras will ever be taken on the track..?

No, I am saying I do not care about Ferrari. How cars look or what they offer.
The same way I do not care about Gucci and other useless brands. Been to Mykonos month ago and have seen all those rich people taking over the city. Yes, there is lots of them, and they have monies, but that not species I want to be around or people I want look up to.

 

[Wolfram]

BTW, how much this Ferrari 488 cost?
Can it beat my 12k naked bike, with 1.1L engine? ;D

View attachment 9679

Ferrari 488:
0-100kph - 3.0s
0-200kph - 8.6s
0-300kph - 24.1s

So yes, off the line I'll have your Tuono V4 1100 RR. You'll catch me on the straight, but throw in any corners and you're dust.

 

[Magma]

The Emira does have Ferrari looks and that is a huge draw. But yes, the downside is the performance and now even the famous Lotus handling seems to be lacking according to some.
So it basically leaves the Emira for someone who wants to have a supercar look alike, without spending similar money. And the trade-off is performance. If you want your cake and eat it too, then you'll have to go elsewhere. Some are OK with that, some won't be.
I am probably OK with that as the 812 is my ultimate dream but even if I could make it a reality, I'm not sure I would. However, minus the price point, similar reasons keep me hesitant about Lotus ownership. Reliability, small dealer network, parts available, maintenance difficulty. It's funny everyone complains about the ubiquitousness of Porsche, but there are plus sides to having a car that is well loved and respected. And depending where you live, Porsche's are still quite rare.

 

[kenniGT]

Ferrari 488:
0-100kph - 3.0s
0-200kph - 8.6s
0-300kph - 24.1s

So yes, off the line I'll have your Tuono V4 1100 RR. You'll catch me on the straight, but throw in any corners and you're dust.

Well, in real world, Ferrari will stay in the traffic
That is my experience from alpine roads, all supercars go uphill behind some camper van or ford fiesta, unable to overtake.

Does 207k Ferrari sound as good as my 12k tuono?


Of course I am not being serious here. Cars and bikes have their advantages and disadvantages.

 

[lion shf]

BTW, how much this Ferrari 488 cost?
Can it beat my 12k naked bike, with 1.1L engine? ;D

View attachment 9679

what could possibly go wrong.

 

[TomE]

Ferrari sold 11,155 cars last year. Lotus sold 1,710. I would say Ferrari are doing something right.

I don't want to overly dump on Lotus - I've been a fan for years and, as I said, I absolutely love my Elise. I just think they got this car very wrong. It could have been a legendary last hurrah for the ICE Lotus - like Porsche went all-in with the awesome GT4RS, Chevrolet have done their thing with the C8 etc. But for some reason from Lotus we have a supercar lookalike that recycles a 15-year-old drivetrain without the refinements the later Evoras enjoyed in a softer but pretty shell... Meanwhile the likes of Alpine, KTM, BAC etc. are doing the Lotus thing way better than Lotus.

I'm genuinely annoyed. I had an early deposit in. Really wanted to love this car.

By your own reasoning Lotus have got it right. They’ve got a nearly 2 year waiting list and have deposits down for more Emiras in the first 18 months than the entire 12 years of Evora production.

I too would have liked something more clearly differentiated from the Evora GT410 in terms of performance. But Lotus has decided to tackle the points seen as weak in the Evora: daily usability, interior materials and tech, price point, and exterior looks.

 

[kenniGT]

I wonder what proportion of Emiras will ever be taken on the track..?

I am not sure, as it is more sports road car, with track okish performance. methinks.

I have been to Nurburgring once, and was plenty of race cars, but no Ferraris.

 

[lion shf]

No, I am saying I do not care about Ferrari. How cars look or what they offer.
The same way I do not care about Gucci and other useless brands. Been to Mykonos month ago and have seen all those rich people taking over the city. Yes, there is lots of them, and they have monies, but that not species I want to be around or people I want look up to.

To my rich friend “let’s go to Vegas this weekend for the Bo fight”
He says hell yeah I’m in
Same question to my poor friend
“Can’t I’m bartending this weekend”

You’d really rather hang out with poors?

 

[lion shf]

By your own reasoning Lotus have got it right. They’ve got a nearly 2 year waiting list and have deposits down for more Emiras in the first 18 months than the entire 12 years of Evora production.

I too would have liked something more clearly differentiated from the Evora GT410 in terms of performance. But Lotus has decided to tackle the points seen as weak in the Evora: daily usability, interior materials and tech, price point, and exterior looks.

Let’s put a wait on the price point point

 

[kenniGT]

To my rich friend “let’s go to Vegas this weekend for the Bo fight”
He says hell yeah I’m in
Same question to my poor friend
“Can’t I’m bartending this weekend”

You’d really rather hang out with poors?

Have a trip to Mykonos, and you will understand what I say. Yes, in this case, I am more than happy to be with poor.

 

[Toomanyloti]

There's been so much said about the Emira's 'supercar' looks here, but does anyone else think it's a shame it doesn't look like a Lotus? I think pretty much every car that Lotus has designed thus far has been unmistakably a Lotus: Esprit, Elan, Elise, Exige, Evora - they were all really distinctive and didn't ape anything else.

And now we have the 'supercar'-looking Emira which is a blatant copy of Ferrari's designs, and there have been many comments here that people are hoping it will be mistaken for a Ferrari (and it probably will).

View attachment 9675
(Ferrari 812)

View attachment 9676
(Ferrari 488 Pista)

But it's got absolutely none of the performance of a Ferrari - even one from a few generations back. It doesn't even have the performance of Lotus's own outgoing final edition three E's, and lukewarm reviews where the previous E cars were pretty unanimously brilliantly received. Yet the Emira's looks have been designed to fake being a supecar, and people are lapping it up.

So what exactly is it then? It all feels a bit fake Rolex to me...

You make a fair point. I was dropping my daughter off at school and even she said everyone will think the emira is a ferrari here at school. I told her to tell them its new, its a Fakerari!!! I simply don't care.

With respect to fans of Ferrari I think they are incredible machines but after the 355 they all look like space ships designed by several committees based on different planets in different galaxies. The side profile above is shocking. From the Seat rest back... wtf.

I'm not bashing because I cant afford etc. Good luck to anyone who can and loves the car. I doff my hat in your direction just not for me this new stuff. I do have loads of shit I could sell and get an older used model if it were a thing for me.

When the Esprit arrived it did not look like an Elan (granted the other wedges came before).

When I put the dipper down i just had a name and knew it was (hopefully) going to be a Lotus.

I was impressed when I saw it and can see old and new it its design. It seems that they made a swiss army knife in an attempt to please everyone down the middle. ie which ever tool you fold out there's a better one in a snap on tool box...

I still don't care its not perfect in every way. What or who is?

I don't get that someone would want to track an Emira when one can buy all manner of crazy tools to take on track. Its a bit heavy and a bit underpowered. Save up and get a KTM-GTR thing (oh that zaust sound).

Lotus again is reinventing itself and we either embrace it or let it go. Its quite clear us minions are of no consequence in the big picture. Its a pity we have this delivery sh!t show but I honestly don't think 'they' care at all we are too insignificant. I'm cool with that now but it will hurt them eventually if not already.

 

[lion shf]

Have a trip to Mykonos, and you will understand what I say. Yes, in this case, I am more than happy to be with poor.

I’ll see your M whatever and raise you a Haiti

 

[Calran]

By your own reasoning Lotus have got it right. They’ve got a nearly 2 year waiting list and have deposits down for more Emiras in the first 18 months than the entire 12 years of Evora production.

I too would have liked something more clearly differentiated from the Evora GT410 in terms of performance. But Lotus has decided to tackle the points seen as weak in the Evora: daily usability, interior materials and tech, price point, and exterior looks.

Do we know if the wait list is still close to 2 years Tom?

I know that was quoted in the early days but since i’ve seen people quoting 14 months etc.

Imagine there have also been quite a lot of drop outs with likely more to follow.

Would certainly be interesting to see what the waiting list is as of today. Think it may well be closer to 12 months……

 

[RENDERMAN]

There's been so much said about the Emira's 'supercar' looks here, but does anyone else think it's a shame it doesn't look like a Lotus? I think pretty much every car that Lotus has designed thus far has been unmistakably a Lotus: Esprit, Elan, Elise, Exige, Evora - they were all really distinctive and didn't ape anything else.

And now we have the 'supercar'-looking Emira which is a blatant copy of Ferrari's designs, and there have been many comments here that people are hoping it will be mistaken for a Ferrari (and it probably will).

View attachment 9675
(Ferrari 812)

View attachment 9676
(Ferrari 488 Pista)

But it's got absolutely none of the performance of a Ferrari - even one from a few generations back. It doesn't even have the performance of Lotus's own outgoing final edition three E's, and lukewarm reviews where the previous E cars were pretty unanimously brilliantly received. Yet the Emira's looks have been designed to fake being a supecar, and people are lapping it up.

So what exactly is it then? It all feels a bit fake Rolex to me...

Stop picking us poor people, we can't afford a F.E.R.R.A.R.I. (I'm texting now) I'll fake it until I make it! as designers we always get influenced by great design, and no doubt Lotus has been influenced from Ferrari as well as McLaren but the best car designers on planet earth belong to VW's Lamborghini...

 

[kenniGT]

what could possibly go wrong.

Yes, on bike you have to be very sensible and sharp. Tuono for instance has 174hp. 220kg weight, with rider it is ~300kg. So power to weight ratio is quite good. On motorbike every road is 4 times wider than motorbike, so can be treated almost like a race track in regards of choosing line and hitting apex. This means a lot of fun on twisty road But I would also love to have lightest Elise, with this Aprilia v4 engine. It revs up to 11k rpm and sounds amazing.

 

[emiraspain]

Hmmmm....
1. We say it doesnt look like a Lotus, since it doesnt look like an Elise or Exige, which in turn dont really look like the Evora. Not sure about the reasoning there, but in any case when the Elise came out firstly, did it look like the previous Lotus car, the Elan? No, not at all, in fact it didnt look like any Lotus ever designed, it was new and it saved the company from Ruination.
So, I am not sure it needs to look like the previous Lotus's, as in reality, they were not that good looking anyway. The Elise was cute, the exige is ugly, 2 cars rolled into one. The Evora didnt sell well, but drove very well, so one can only assume the awkward angle 3/4 looks had a lot to do with it, that and price/reputation etc.
As has been said before, the 1st "new" lotus is the Evija, and that is now the Lotus identity the rest of the cars will follow....simple.
Harry, who knows a bit more than most of us on here, said it could be a maclaren in terms of looks. There is no doubt from the front there are elements copied from the Ferrari above too, you have to see it, the inlets, the lights etc.

2. As has been said many times, for Lotus to get traction, they need mass appeal, not track appeal. It is unfortuante they have said this car is the Evora turned to max and then some as its 100% not, it is at best a late Evora at 80%, which for the Lotusfiles wont be good enough and I understand that, but they must understand an Evora at 110% wont sell! How many people buy GT4's..... and thats based on a base model 718 that "sucks", but that base model sells way more than lotus ever will and it doesnt go on track and does not get big milage, its aimed at a certain customer.
L O T U S is chasing the SAME customer and those customers are not in this forum and they dont give a xxxx about what we think, they want a nice looking car, that looks cool, is more or less practical and very reliable.... that is red lines at 6250 o 6750, that it has 400Hp or 490Hp, that the manual is as good as the MX5 on track....that this the other, they could not care less.
THis is the customer Lotus wanted and this is what they have got. I repeat, the rest of those who want the real deal, the Lotus to take on the GT4, need to wait and stop bitching as this base car at 60k base, its NOT it, it was never going to be it, just Lotus told us it was, but we have seen over the last year that Lotus tell us a lot of xxxx each time they speak and its rarely true.

3. There is no 3... I refer the honourable gentleman to 1 and 2
How can so many new threads be on here and we all say the same things hahaha.... where are the reviews of the Europeans that have had their cars for 7-10 days.... WTH is up with that.
I'd have made a youtube video by now of about 2 hours...

 

[Lotustoronto]

There's been so much said about the Emira's 'supercar' looks here, but does anyone else think it's a shame it doesn't look like a Lotus? I think pretty much every car that Lotus has designed thus far has been unmistakably a Lotus: Esprit, Elan, Elise, Exige, Evora - they were all really distinctive and didn't ape anything else.

And now we have the 'supercar'-looking Emira which is a blatant copy of Ferrari's designs, and there have been many comments here that people are hoping it will be mistaken for a Ferrari (and it probably will).

View attachment 9675
(Ferrari 812)

View attachment 9676
(Ferrari 488 Pista)

But it's got absolutely none of the performance of a Ferrari - even one from a few generations back. It doesn't even have the performance of Lotus's own outgoing final edition three E's, and lukewarm reviews where the previous E cars were pretty unanimously brilliantly received. Yet the Emira's looks have been designed to fake being a supecar, and people are lapping it up.

So what exactly is it then? It all feels a bit fake Rolex to me...

It’s meant to look like a baby Evija, which doesn’t look like a Ferrari to my eye. It is also a big departure from previous Lotus cars. It’s the new design language and although shares similarities with other mid engine cars, It has more lineage with Evija than Ferrari.

 

[kitkat]

Hmm, I think you’d all have to be kidding yourself if you didn’t admit it looks a bit like a baby Ferrari.

The on paper appeal to me in no specific order is: exotic car looks, double wishbone all around, linear power band, modern interior, low-ish weight for the times, simple reliable engine, easily maintainable myself, hydraulic rack, reasonable price (little high in USA).

Where it distinguished itself from a Ferrari is the price point, reliability, and maintainability. Where it disappoints is it seems to be less performant than the outgoing car, and that’s a damn shame.

A test drive should tell me all I need to know.

 

[kitkat]

It’s meant to look like a baby Evija, which doesn’t look like a Ferrari to my eye. It is also a big departure from previous Lotus cars. It’s the new design language and although shares similarities with other mid engine cars, I had more lineage with Evija than Ferrari.

While I agree the evija has a lot of new design language for lotus, and some of it got brought down to the Emira — the softening of the design language and styling absolutely distills down to past Ferrari styling. Wether that was intentional or not probably isn’t going to matter to anyone.