I'm out - the cancellations thread

[Pops68]

Well I doubt it'll be boring if they're out there setting records, but I get what you're saying.

I'm very excited to soon own one of the last ICE mid engine sportscars ever. And the fact that it'll have 3 pedals and built by a former F1 winning company makes it all that more special!

It should be a great car. Congrats to you for your patience..

 

[Citizen]

That’s the same feeling when was the battle from Vinyl djs Vs CD players dj

I’m on the side of vinyl and I still play with my Technics m5G and mk2

No traktor or any software please

 

[RafP]

I am fully out now (refund due any day), flip flopped 3 times as a real affinity to Lotus. Was nearly swung by an offer to let me amend spec. Interesting given hard lines taken before, suggests lots of cancellations and trying to mitigate order loss.

What settled it for me was reminded over xmas by a mate of all the hassle I had with my first Evora, Exige and last Evora and generally how crap Lotus and dealers were, Lotus parts delays / lotus dragging feet on warranty issues.

Amazed how time, a new look car and an affinity to a brand makes you forget hassle.

We worked out how many months the Lotus’s were off the road waiting for warranty claims and or parts. Scary in a total of 4 years of combined ownership it was 4.5 months! Basically ~10% of the time under my ownership was waiting on Lotus to approve claims and parts. Latterly some claims deniers totally leading me to bin off the 410.

Also trips to and from dealers for issues totalled 10 trips (20 if you count the drive back). ~15% of all my cars mileages were taking the car to and from the dealer to be fixed is rather insane! To be fair we discounted a few when in was in a trailer otherwise would have been 12.

Sobering when in 25 years driving that’s more than every other car put together (and we’ve owned 18).

As the Lotus were all the same drive train, transmission and it’s the same this time would be silly to not listen to past experience and the facts.

So gone back to the dark side and GT4 RS incoming, it’s a much better car in all areas bar looks. What swung it was the hassle factor Lotus brings as noted above. Porsches just work and when you have issues (they aren’t as reliable as some say) they get fixed professionally and in a timely manner.

In the mean time I am stunned that I am actually enjoying my wife’s new Tesla model Y Performance now.

Initially wanted to hate it but it’s a surprisingly brilliant road family car. Comfy when you need it to be and blisteringly quick when you need it to be, very little touches it when I drive it and it actually handles a British B road well at speed. Amazed as I wanted to hate it but after a few fast road trips it grown on me. Takes a bit of getting used to the numbness lack of sound brings.

But hopping back into 750bhp M6 afterwards with a sports exhaust and permanently open exhaust it just doesn’t feel as quick or nice to drive.

Enjoy your cars when they finally arrive and hope Lotus have upped their aftercare game for you all

 

[hagen111]

Sometimes its funny to read people expect Porsche like, Toyota like support levels in terms of parts, dealers, etc from a small traditional manufacturer like Lotus. FFS...this is a small artisan manufacturer. I actually love to steer away from all the controlled environments and go on an Adventure. I dig problems, exclusivity, different approaches. A handbuild product that is not for the masses.

I bought a BMW this summer and went to the dealer yesterday...one in a glass walled building, with plenty of receptionists and office clerks...so an oil and filter change is 620 euros nowadays...end of the day you get a call from a lady who is there just to phone customers their car is ready...its the only thing she does...when asking a question, they have no clue at all what they are talking about.

I asked them to inspect my mirror as it doesn't function correctly...and the answer was...'replace'. Repairs and or taking something apart doesn't exist anymore.

I love my Lotus dealer....they are nice, personal, can actually repair stuff (they need too ;-) ), quote me decent rates, serve me coffee...I feel like a 'good customer'. Thumbs up!

Now I was disappointed in the Emira reviews until Shmee and Seen Through Glass reviews came out....and will definitely take mine, and if needed sharpen it over time. So changed opinion and be patient.

 

[RafP]

Sometimes its funny to read people expect Porsche like, Toyota like support levels in terms of parts, dealers, etc from a small traditional manufacturer like Lotus. FFS...this is a small artisan manufacturer. I actually love to steer away from all the controlled environments and go on an Adventure. I dig problems, exclusivity, different approaches. A handbuild product that is not for the masses.

I bought a BMW this summer and went to the dealer yesterday...one in a glass walled building, with plenty of receptionists and office clerks...so an oil and filter change is 620 euros nowadays...end of the day you get a call from a lady who is there just to phone customers their car is ready...its the only thing she does...when asking a question, they have no clue at all what they are talking about.

I asked them to inspect my mirror as it doesn't function correctly...and the answer was...'replace'. Repairs and or taking something apart doesn't exist anymore.

I love my Lotus dealer....they are nice, personal, can actually repair stuff (they need too ;-) ), quote me decent rates, serve me coffee...I feel like a 'good customer'. Thumbs up!

Now I was disappointed in the Emira reviews until Shmee and Seen Through Glass reviews came out....and will definitely take mine, and if needed sharpen it over time. So changed opinion and be patient.

The irony is my Local Lotus dealer is now a Honda dealer also (so it’s an Honda tech with Lotus training) and the one I used to use (Williams) aren’t great anymore. Last time they damaged my car twice and failed to fix an issue twice.

It gets tiring when you have a 100 mile round trip. Believe me I am a Lotus die hard, had a LE Evora

The artisan days of Lotus are over they now want the glass walled and more expensive servicing approach.

Enjoy the cars I hope to be back in when they bring out a spiced up version and have proven themselves again.

The the annoyance that really got my goat that he reminded me of (brain fogged it out). Was the dreaded brake light switch issue. Dealer had it waiting on Lotus to authorise warranty claim for 2 weeks, then parts would be 1 week. In the end after a week I just ordered part myself had it shipped to dealer same day and paid them to fit it.

Next time I just did it myself (bit fiddly but doable).

That and the fact my old trusted dealer (Williams Lotus) I vowed to never use again after they damaged my car and failed to fix a transmission issue twice.

Final straw for the 410 was Lotus denying an horrific clutch squeak claim (loud enough to be heard over engine with exhaust flaps open). Said wear and tear on a car with bugger all miles on it.

Irony is that leaves my only local Lotus dealer is a joint Honda one and they are shiny show rooms.

Hopefully I check back in next year and they have turned over a new leaf and a spicy version is released.

 

[Tonyshepp]

The irony is my Local Lotus dealer is now a Honda dealer also (so it’s an Honda tech with Lotus training) and the one I used to use (Williams) aren’t great anymore. Last time they damaged my car twice and failed to fix an issue twice.

It gets tiring when you have a 100 mile round trip. Believe me I am a Lotus die hard, had a LE Evora

The artisan days of Lotus are over they now want the glass walled and more expensive servicing approach.

Enjoy the cars I hope to be back in when they bring out a spiced up version and have proven themselves again.

The the annoyance that really got my goat that he reminded me of (brain fogged it out). Was the dreaded brake light switch issue. Dealer had it waiting on Lotus to authorise warranty claim for 2 weeks, then parts would be 1 week. In the end after a week I just ordered part myself had it shipped to dealer same day and paid them to fit it.

Next time I just did it myself (bit fiddly but doable).

That and the fact my old trusted dealer (Williams Lotus) I vowed to never use again after they damaged my car and failed to fix a transmission issue twice.

Final straw for the 410 was Lotus denying an horrific clutch squeak claim (loud enough to be heard over engine with exhaust flaps open). Said wear and tear on a car with bugger all miles on it.

Irony is that leaves my only local Lotus dealer is a joint Honda one and they are shiny show rooms.

Hopefully I check back in next year and they have turned over a new leaf and a spicy version is released.

The aftercare is the main bugbear for me too, i'm not used to it and dont want to get used to lacklustre after care. I've got my checkout email and another test drive on Monday to really convince myself the car is for me and i can cope with the after hassle which will come.

 

[Carbuilder]

Sometimes its funny to read people expect Porsche like, Toyota like support levels in terms of parts, dealers, etc from a small traditional manufacturer like Lotus. FFS...this is a small artisan manufacturer.

Should it depend on the size of the car manufacturer or the price of the car that determines how well the support is? I bought a car from a large manufacturer, but a much cheaper car than a Lotus. The dealer is an hour drive away; there are closer ones, but that is where I bought it. I was told if I had any issues they would come and pick up the car, leave me a loner, and return the car when it was fixed. With China paying the bills, no reason Lotus couldn't offer the same service to those without dealers close by.

And keep in mind how Lotus is going on and on about how the quality of this car is going to be far better than anything they have produced. Shouldn't the level of service go along with that? I don't think Lotus is doing a good job if at this point potential buyers are already expecting it to be an unreliable car with service and dealer issues.

 

[Tonyshepp]

Should it depend on the size of the car manufacturer or the price of the car that determines how well the support is? I bought a car from a large manufacturer, but a much cheaper car than a Lotus. The dealer is an hour drive away; there are closer ones, but that is where I bought it. I was told if I had any issues they would come and pick up the car, leave me a loner, and return the car when it was fixed. With China paying the bills, no reason Lotus couldn't offer the same service to those without dealers close by.

And keep in mind how Lotus is going on and on about how the quality of this car is going to be far better than anything they have produced. Shouldn't the level of service go along with that? I don't think Lotus is doing a good job if at this point potential buyers are already expecting it to be an unreliable car with service and dealer issues.

I'll be honest what happens when the car breaks down - most brands provide a courtesy car - these things haven't been tested yet.

 

[Nova]

I am in the US so the situation is a bit different here because we only have independent dealers. Lotus is in the uncomfortable segment of being a low volume car as well as being relatively affordable - so I don't see how a dealer can have enough margins on it to offer loaner cars, pick-up service, etc, unless the dealer carries multiple other brands like Aston Martin, Bentley, McLaren, etc. My nearest local dealer is a brand new franchise, at a location that used to be a used car sales lot, with cracked parking lot pavement and a building that looks like the sort they blow up in low budget action movies. I doubt they can afford to provide high end service levels.

 

[695 to Emira]

Just sent an email to cancel Feb 23 build.

Anyone after manual, Seneca, black wheels, sports, black pack, yellow calipers, alcantara may be in for a treat.

 

[CarGuy07]

I’m going back and forth on whether to cancel now, or wait until March/April for a proper test drive and decide then. The car looks amazing, but the last 10-15 minutes quick drive didn’t do anything for me. Struggling to justify the purchase. I also don’t like having shitty CS so a bit more concerned hearing some of the feedback from you guys regarding after service.

For those that say we shouldn’t expect a boutique automaker to have top notch services, you are wrong. If anything, such companies SHOULD prioritize CS. Think of Amazon, Zappos, etc. All of the startups/small companies I’ve dealt with have always made it incredibly easy should things go wrong with their products. It is absolutely no excuse for Lotus.

 

[Eagle7]

So far Lotus has responded very quickly with any issues, even sending people from the factory to look at an issue if necessary. I'd go with what Lotus is actually doing, instead of listening to negative Nancy's and their caustic negativity.

 

[kitkat]

I’m going back and forth on whether to cancel now, or wait until March/April for a proper test drive and decide then. The car looks amazing, but the last 10-15 minutes quick drive didn’t do anything for me. Struggling to justify the purchase. I also don’t like having shitty CS so a bit more concerned hearing some of the feedback from you guys regarding after service.

For those that say we shouldn’t expect a boutique automaker to have top notch services, you are wrong. If anything, such companies SHOULD prioritize CS. Think of Amazon, Zappos, etc. All of the startups/small companies I’ve dealt with have always made it incredibly easy should things go wrong with their products. It is absolutely no excuse for Lotus.

I forget if you're in the FE first orders or not at Boardwalk -- I share the same struggles as you regarding service. Are they offering a second round of test drives that I hadn't heard about?

 

[Twin Cam]

So far Lotus has responded very quickly with any issues, even sending people from the factory to look at an issue if necessary. I'd go with what Lotus is actually doing, instead of listening to negative Nancy's and their caustic negativity.

Quite agree, an awful lot of hearsay on here from people who wanted to be first to have the car but don’t have the mindset for being an early adopter of a new model coming out of a new factory.
The last of an old model is usually less problematic than the first of a new model, I believe Lotus may be one of the few car producers that this won’t apply to, so I tip my hat to them until it is proven otherwise.

 

[CarGuy07]

I forget if you're in the FE first orders or not at Boardwalk -- I share the same struggles as you regarding service. Are they offering a second round of test drives that I hadn't heard about?

I missed the FE batch. From talking to folks at the last driving event, they mentioned demos arriving in March. I’m not sure if that’s still on schedule or delayed further.

 

[kitkat]

I missed the FE batch. From talking to folks at the last driving event, they mentioned demos arriving in March. I’m not sure if that’s still on schedule or delayed further.

I'm in the first FE batch and demo car (single car in green) they ordered will arrive at the same time. I highly doubt it arrives anytime before July.

 

[Hobiedick]

Quite agree, an awful lot of hearsay on here from people who wanted to be first to have the car but don’t have the mindset for being an early adopter of a new model coming out of a new factory.
The last of an old model is usually less problematic than the first of a new model, I believe Lotus may be one of the few car producers that this won’t apply to, so I tip my hat to them until it is proven otherwise.

I was a pre-reveal depositor and am still waiting for a car which was supposed to originally delivered in April 22, my beef with Lotus is lack of proper communication/truth from their Customer Service Department.

 

[TomE]

Just sent an email to cancel Feb 23 build.

Anyone after manual, Seneca, black wheels, sports, black pack, yellow calipers, alcantara may be in for a treat.

What were your main reasons for cancelling and are you getting something else instead or sticking with what you already have?

 

[Lotustoronto]

I’m going back and forth on whether to cancel now, or wait until March/April for a proper test drive and decide then. The car looks amazing, but the last 10-15 minutes quick drive didn’t do anything for me. Struggling to justify the purchase. I also don’t like having shitty CS so a bit more concerned hearing some of the feedback from you guys regarding after service.

For those that say we shouldn’t expect a boutique automaker to have top notch services, you are wrong. If anything, such companies SHOULD prioritize CS. Think of Amazon, Zappos, etc. All of the startups/small companies I’ve dealt with have always made it incredibly easy should things go wrong with their products. It is absolutely no excuse for Lotus.

So far Lotus has responded very quickly with any issues, even sending people from the factory to look at an issue if necessary. I'd go with what Lotus is actually doing, instead of listening to negative Nancy's and their caustic negativity.

Wanted to reply to the two contrasting views;

@CarGuy07 - You are correct. Boutique anything (hotels, cars, watches, clothes etc.) should in theory provide a boutique customer service experience. Something more personalized and better than say an average/Low end manufacturer. With that said, I do not expect high end boutique experience. This isn't like buying a Ferrari, Aston, Bugatti etc. So my expectation for service is somewhere in the middle.

@Eagle7 - Lotus has responded to forum members differently, even when asked the same question. Just look at @RafP being offered to change his spec with min. delay to take delivery of his Emira, meanwhile @TomE gets put to back of the line for the same question. There has been many instances in which Lotus has dropped the ball on CS Comm's. Also Rafp is speaking of his personal Lotus dealer experience from owning three different Lotus cars, I would place him in a position to give his opinion better than most. Let's not start with the debacle for test drives - where i4 guys got in before V6 F/E for a test drive.

With all that said, It does seem that Lotus is trying very hard to rectify these situations. How well they achieve this is yet to be seen. Until proven that it is improved, I think proceeding with caution and listening to previous Lotus owners about their experiences with warranty claims/service will be more telling than hoping that they do better. I have not seen enough to say they are significantly better than before.

Last note - the US/CAN market and your perception of Lotus CS will be vary dependent on you dealer. Not all Lotus dealers are created equal and the experiences will vary greatly. More so than perhaps any other car dealer/manufacturer I have seen. Some Lotus dealerships look brand new - (i.e. Lotus of Calgary in Canada is attached to lambo, Rolls Royce, Bentley, Aston) and others well... look a little less impressive. I am sure dealer experiences will vary greatly when it comes to the CS side of things.

 

[Leonard]

Wanted to reply to the two contrasting views;

@CarGuy07 - You are correct. Boutique anything (hotels, cars, watches, clothes etc.) should in theory provide a boutique customer service experience. Something more personalized and better than say an average/Low end manufacturer. With that said, I do not expect high end boutique experience. This isn't like buying a Ferrari, Aston, Bugatti etc. So my expectation for service is somewhere in the middle.

@Eagle7 - Lotus has responded to forum members differently, even when asked the same question. Just look at @RafP being offered to change his spec with min. delay to take delivery of his Emira, meanwhile @TomE gets put to back of the line for the same question. There has been many instances in which Lotus has dropped the ball on CS Comm's. Also Rafp is speaking of his personal Lotus dealer experience from owning three different Lotus cars, I would place him in a position to give his opinion better than most. Let's not start with the debacle for test drives - where i4 guys got in before V6 F/E for a test drive.

With all that said, It does seem that Lotus is trying very hard to rectify these situations. How well they achieve this is yet to be seen. Until proven that it is improved, I think proceeding with caution and listening to previous Lotus owners about their experiences with warranty claims/service will be more telling than hoping that they do better. I have not seen enough to say they are significantly better than before.

Last note - the US/CAN market and your perception of Lotus CS will be vary dependent on you dealer. Not all Lotus dealers are created equal and the experiences will vary greatly. More so than perhaps any other car dealer/manufacturer I have seen. Some Lotus dealerships look brand new - (i.e. Lotus of Calgary in Canada is attached to lambo, Rolls Royce, Bentley, Aston) and others well... look a little less impressive. I am sure dealer experiences will vary greatly when it comes to the CS side of things.

Consistency